Blackhawks Sign Robin Lehner

The Blackhawks stunned the hockey world late Monday afternoon with the announcement that the team has signed veteran goaltender Robin Lehner to a one-year, $5M contract.

Lehner, 27, was a finalist for the Vezina Trophy this past season after setting an Islanders record with a .930 save percentage. He, with Thomas Greiss, won the 2019 William Jennings Trophy. Lehner won a career-best 25 games with a 2.13 goals against average.

Lehner was also awarded the 2019 Bill Masterton Memorial Trophy, given annually to the NHL player who best exemplifies the qualities of perseverance, sportsmanship and dedication to ice hockey.

This deal means the Blackhawks have $11M committed to the goaltending posistion between Lehner and Corey Crawford. Given Crawford’s concussion issues the past two seasons, this is at least an expensive insurance policy should Crawford miss another extended period of play.

However, both the contracts of both Crawford and Lehner expire after the 2019-20 season.

262 thoughts on “Blackhawks Sign Robin Lehner

  1. This is a WINNING move! With Crawford’s questionable health we have Delia and Lankonen (?) who aren’t proven CUP contenders yet so this is a “winner-take-all” strategy… the best move I’ve seen Stan make!!

  2. I like the move. Rock-solid goaltending and gives Delia and Lankinen the time to develop before taking over in 2020, Or Lehner becomes the #1 in 2020 and get’s a longer bridge-type deal. Now I am wondering if they may know something about Crow’s future that we don’t, like he’s going to retire after this season’s contract is up?.

  3. Bowman pulled it off again.One of the best signings of free agents especially since it is only one year deal. Crawford’s health is too risky and Delia is not ready yet to be a number one. Lehrer is coming off his best season of his career. Now Lehrer, along with Shaw, Carpenter, deHaan, Maatta, and possibly Dach will get the Hawks back to respectability. Great job Stan. GO HAWKS…..

  4. So, are Crow and Lehner going to battle it out for the 1A spot? Lehner did have a great year with the Isles last season but he has never posted those kind of stats with a bad defensive team. With Maatta and DeHaan in the mix now you have to assume the Hawks will be better defensively this year but… Idk. It seems like Stan is hedging his bets and hoping he just found Crow’s long term replacement. This also means the Hawks are now over the cap so if an AA trade is going to happen I think it decreases his value. Who else is a potential trade piece. Murphy? Saad? I’d say Seabrook but I just don’t see it.

  5. A nice move. I’d say crow is gone next year. Now any news on a trade involving anisimov or one of our d men?

  6. I posted under the Kampf thread that Lehner has battled alcoholism and is bipolar. NYI took a chance on him and he resurrected his career.

    For reference, here are save percentages for a few Hall of Famers:

    Patrick Roy: .910
    Dominik Hasek: .922
    Martin Brodeur: .912

    If Lehner no longer has issues and proves himself at least halfway through the season, let’s hope he can be extended. Players would need to be moved to allow DCat and Strome to be re-signed.

  7. So 8 million dollars for backup goalies the last two seasons. I love Lehner’s story. Great guy. Now why did the Islanders not sign him???
    Why hasn’t Bowman drafted and developed a goalie in 1o years? This makes sense if Crawford retires and Lankinen becomes the back up. Delia is not an NHL goalie who by the way, Bowman jumped the gun, as usual and gave him way too much money as well.
    I would have rather seen that money go to someone who can play with Teows and Kane, not Caggiula who will be great playing on the 4th line with Shaw and Carpenter.
    Hopefully he signs Perlini, more upside at 22 years old. Don’t care about Kampf. Depth guy for Rockford like Sikura.

  8. Wow. Just Wow. Crawford will likely ask to be dealt or be at least willing to waive his no trade.
    Hockey world shocked.
    Hawks are going for it.

  9. Crawford has serious head injuries which should probably cause him to retire and the Hawks go out and get a vezina finalist from last year and you’re complaining. Perlini has upside? You must have only paid attention to the 2 weeks Perlini felt like showing up. He sucks, wouldn’t waste a dime on him.

  10. Hull, that was my thought. The Isles signed Varlamov, who is 31 years old to Lehner’s 27, to a 4 year 5m AAV. Why would Lehner not take that offer if it was given, and if it wasn’t offered, why? It just seems like a strange signing to me since Lehner just played on a 1 year prove it deal, and he did, so why would he take another 1 year prove it deal? I like the signing for the insurance it provides but there is something we don’t know. At least it feels that way.

  11. Crow is precarious, they needed a a 1A backup. You don’t win in the NHL without good goaltending,end of story.

  12. Also Hull, Delia is on a 2-way contract. His 1m AAV isn’t over paying for a goalie that might help your team out. His cap hit can be buried in the AHL.

  13. Beautiful move! I believe Craw is on his last year of his contract for 6 mil. His Blackhawk legacy is in place but he has not been the same period. Lehner is on a one year prove it deal for 5 mil. It’s basically a wash. It protects the Hawks either way. I’m sure this was discussed with Robin before he signed. With the moves we made we will be tough to play against. I just hope that Bowman does not have to sweeten the pot to get rid of AA. Every time we get burned. I’d like to see Perlini signed already.

  14. The additions this year have been a real surprise. In one of the Jason Bourne movies, some one says “what just happened here”. That is exactly what I thought when Lehner was announced. I was like holy shoots, this was a good pickup. Stan solidified our entire roster without over spending and giving up the farm. We still have our top DEF prospects and a few forwards. I actually like the Carpenter deal for a 4th line center at a $1 x 3 and kampf for $1 x 2. Shaw will not be on the 4th line. This team is shaping up to be a very nice team. If Henri is ready, you may see Murphy gone. I thought maybe Q would ask for Keith.

  15. OUTSTANDING!

    Stanley hitting the right notes. First improved the d-corps, then got tougher to play against and improved the bottom-6 and PK, and now set up a dynamite goalie tandem as an insurance policy against Crawford’s health concerns.

    As it stand right now, on paper, this is an improved team.

  16. Lehner said he didn’t turn down any offer. So did the Islanders just sign Varlamov without making an offer to Lehner? Seems odd, I agree. Also, you think SB informed Crow first that he was signing Lehner? Whatever the case, if all remain healthy, our defense and goaltending got a nice shot of adrenaline this off season. Let’s see how it plays out.

  17. SB just said Perlini will be signed so Hull will have one less thing to complain about. Regarding your comment “ why hasn’t SB drafted and developed a goalie in the last 10 years” you can ask that question to 80% of the league. If you hadn’t noticed there aren’t very many top goalies in the league and for the next year we have two of them. Who else would you have rather spent that money on for a one year deal? We are a much better team than 30 days ago and should be very competitive next year. We acquired Matta, de Haan, Shaw, Carpenter and Lehner (all experienced NHL players) plus Sarella in exchange for Kahun, Forsling and a couple of picks while staying disciplined with cap management. I think this was excellent work by SB.

  18. Agreed MS sums it up nicely except for the Perlini part, I will stand by my disdain for him

  19. Top goaltending, strengthened Defense, bigger forwards- all good improvements… just worry about speed. But the year should start out great!!

  20. If Dach stays in Chicago this year it will be as a wing on Jonathan Toews line. Low pressure spot teams are focusing on Toews and Kane. Make the game a lot easier for the young man.

  21. Stan Bowman did a top notch job today. He acquired a Masterton winner & Vezna finalist along with 2 solid bottom 6 Centers. Add that to Maata & De Haan and the Hawks are a 100% better. Hopefully Anisimov and Saad will be moved and we can sign Dzingle as well with some cap room to spare. Remember, the haters (like Hull65) are gonna hate no matter what Stan did today. Maybe they should all stay home when the Hawks have another Stanley Cup Parade! LET’S GO HAWKS!!!!

  22. With all of these trades and signings, am now in the “don’t sign Perlini camp”. We are loaded with new veterans and need to make room for developing players. The eye needs to be on the 20/21 and 21/22 prize of making a serious run. Perlini is a poor checker and loses puck battles. As for intensity, he is the complete opposite of Shaw. Free up cap space for other players.

  23. If Lehner plays well and stays healthy he likely gets extended before the end of the year. Out of nowhere, that would give us a not just a goalie but a very good one. He kind of fell into our laps for a test drive with, in essence, an option to re-up him. This is a good move.

  24. Lehner received a lot of support (on and off the ice) with the Isles. Good defensive scheme with Trotz on the ice and a support team helping him with his personal issues off the ice.
    Then June 23 he said he had no intention of leaving the Isles…but then a few days ago he said there was no way he would be staying. Very odd and we will never know what happened there. I sure hope he puts up numbers even close to last year for us for years to come, but it seems to me that we have very expensive question marks now in net.

  25. Lehner said the Isles gave him a take it or leave it offer, with 7/1 approaching, Lou L needed an answer. That’s just plain smart. When Lehner said no, Lou turned to Varlomov and Lehner suddenly was more available than most GMs thought.
    Kudos to Stan = awake, alert, aware.
    In baseball terms, he got a number one starter.

  26. In : Maatta, deHaan, Shaw, Carpenter, Lehner.

    Out : Kahun, 5th round pick, Forsling, Forsberg, 2nd round pick, 3rd round pick.

  27. Better defensively with deHaan and Maatta. Better goaltending with a Jennings award Winner- Lehner, some grit namely Shaw, and a decent faceoff guy in Carpenter. Plus the fact that Dach is going to get a very serious look.
    This should jumpstart the Hawks
    . Let’s give Stan some credit for these excellent moves. He has addressed a lot of the shortcomings without giving up the farm.
    Colliton will have the start of the season to continue his plan, which the players finally bought into towards the end of last season. All is good. GO HAWKS…

  28. Lehner had a pretty strong playoffs to go with his regular season and said publicly he wanted to stay with Isles. Don”t really get why that didn’t happen.

    Wonder if they want a goalie to carry the load for regular season and have Crawford healthy for one more playoff run, similar Isles did with Billie Smith. Then the hope is Lehner will be the main guy the next season. Delia and Lankinen solid depth.

    Obviously needing someone to solidify goaltending situation to start last season Lehner’s situation last summer didn’t make him a legitimate option.

    Agree not a big fan of Perllini, seemed to only play when he felt like it, intensity was lacking last year.

    Should be in good shape to withstand injuries, which is huge as well as addressing areas that needed upgrades this summer. Having guys like Lehner, Joki, Sikura, Saarela, Wedin and Quenneville as depth when players on ir is not such a bad thing. May be an underlooked strength of this team next season.

  29. Great move – Hawks won’t miss a beat if CC goes down plus even if he doesn’t having Lehner allows them to use the ‘load management’ strategy on him to borrow a bball term

    Good chance Lehner becomes the #1 next year if all goes well this year for him

    If Dach makes the team (and I think he’ll get some NHL games at the start at least) I expect it to be either on Toews’ line or Strome’s – I think you want him to play top 6 instead asking him to be a C right away at the NHL level

    Maybe he can do it (play 3C) but I think you want him in the best place to succeed and play significant minutes if he’s here at all and I think that’s in the top 6 on the wing

    Gotta think one or both of AA and Murphy are on their way out sometime before next July 1 – maybe sooner than later for at least one of them

    All in all no complaining here – I like all the moves Stan has made thus far

  30. I would like to see Shaw in the top 9 rather than on the 4th line

    If Dach makes the team and AA is still here Perlini may be 13/14 FW which would be OK – a good depth piece

  31. Craig – didn’t know about the take it or leave it offer to Lehner. It makes sense if that’s true.

  32. If Stan trades Anisimov and doesn’t take back any cap money and sends Delia and Dahlstrom to Rockford, the Hawks will have about $6.5M to sign Perlini ($1.7M ?) and promote from Rockford roster Sikura ($750K), Kubalik ($925K) and one other guy (Quenneville $750K ?). That will leave about $2.4M is cap space which should be adequate for in-season injury moves (etc.).

    If Dach makes the roster, swap out Quenneville on the roster and subtract around $200K from the $2.4M available cap space. If Dach doesn’t make the team – Kampf plays 3C and Carpenter 4C.

    Sikura-Toews-Kane
    Cat-Strome-Shaw
    Saad-Dach-Kubalik
    Cagiula-Kampf-Carpenter/Perlini

    Keith-Gustafsson
    deHaan-Seabrook
    Maatta-Murphy
    Koekkoek

    Crawford
    Lehner

  33. Kotkiemi was 3rd pick last year and spent entire year with Montreal and averaged 14 minutes per night. Anyone know how he was used? Was he a 3c or did he play wing? He had a solid year which hopefully Dach can duplicate.

  34. Can someone go back a year and look at whatever thread was out when Lehner signed with the Isle? I said that he was the guy we should have gotten from Buffalo. One of our experts said I was foolish and Lehner was terrible. Ok my arm hurts from patting my back so I’ll stop.
    I want Lemieux now or probably next year. Bet ya he’s Panarin’s bodyguard!.

  35. Let me get this straight; 80% of NHL teams haven’t drafted a goalie to groom in past 10yrs so it’s OK that SB hasn’t either? So where were these GM’s when Lehner sat and waited? No better offers than SB’s… bidding against himself AGAIN? Now we have another player (goalie this time) blocking an opportunity. Or has SB just admitted that the players in the wings aren’t good enough to play in the NHL today or maybe ever? Great drafting, great trading and great faith in your farm system. Yeah I know, SB is wonderful.

  36. I know stats don’t tell the whole story and goalie stats can be influenced by the team defense (or lack thereof) in front of him. Last season, Lehner had a very good Islander’s defense in front of him and he posted a .930 save percentage. The 3 previous years in Buffalo he had a not so good defense in front of him and he posted save percentages of .924, .920 and .908. The numbers would indicate he’s a pretty good goalie.

  37. Assuming AA is traded I’ll try

    Dach-Toews-Kane
    Cat-Strome-Perlini
    Saad-Shaw-Kubalik
    Caggiula-Kampf-Carpenter
    Sikura/Quennville

    Keith-Murphy
    de Haan – Seabrook
    Maatta-Gustafsson
    Koekkoek

    Crawford
    Lehner

  38. Stan has had a very fine couple of weeks.
    I have a suspicion Murphy gets traded this summer or at the deadline.

  39. EB that’s when I thought Lehner was good. When he was in Buffalo. Not only the numbers but his Billy Smith attitude. I think more than once I compared him to Smith and Belfour in attitude wise. Guys with Secord mentality are Matt Tkachuk and Lemieux.

  40. When Lehner first came into the NHL with Ottawa I was greatly impressed with him and saw him as a great goaltending talent. After Crow looked mediocre in the playoff series with Arizona I was one of the “Crawford will never make it let’s get someone else” crowd. I advocated for the Hawks to bring in Lehner. Well I and the others were wrong back then. Crawford emerged as a great netminder and Lehner struggled with his personal issues. Now we have come full circle. Crow has struggled with concussions and up and down levels of play while last season Lehner overcame his personal demons and actualized his talent becoming a Vezina finalist and Jennings Trophy winner.
    This is a great pickup. If Crawford is good to go as the old Crawford the Hawks have two AllStar level netminders, a fantastic 1-2 punch combination in the net. If Crawford falters, Lehner proved that he can be the man.
    Last season the mantra was that goaltending wasn’t the issue. Actually it was. Crawford was up and down, likely due to his injury issues, Ward had two good games but in general was putrid and after a nice start Delia revealed that he wasn’t ready for prime time yet. This was a great move by StanBow!

  41. Let’s call a spade a spade: Crow wasn’t good last season. Yes, the defense was bad, but even in the games our defenders allowed less shots than the other teams’ , Crow let us down.

    I like this move very much. Bravo, Stan.

    As proven by Bishop, a great goaltending can get even an average team very far.

  42. ER, thanks for the stats on Lehner when with Buffalo. It shows that Lehner was an above-average goalie while suffering from drug and alcohol addiction. If he is past these issues, don’t think that Lehner will be backing up Crawford. It will be the other way around. We love Crow, but he is constantly struggling with injuries and his best years are, unfortunately, way behind him. If Lehner has a .920 sv% midway through the season, I hope they can extend him for at least another year at $5M per.

    Pete, you and I both reacted the same way to MS’s comments about it being OK for Stan’s failure to develop a goalie in ten years. MS, there are many excellent goalies and they all came out of a team’s system. And are the Hawks’ problems solved by having two of them “for the next year”?

  43. Dare I say, it Was tank ufas. Night and day difference sine around game 30.

    In : Maatta, deHaan, Shaw, Carpenter, Lehner.
    Strome, Perlini, Cagiluga

    Out : Kahun, 5th round pick, Forsling, Forsberg, 2nd round pick, 3rd round pick.
    Schmaltz, Manning, Davidson, Rutta

  44. Lehner said they went ahead without waiting for him to reply. He went back to re negotiate caphit, being only offered less yrs then he wanted, and they did it before he got back to them. He says thats what happened and who ever believes him, fine, and who doesnt it doesnt matter.

    What I read somewhere when I was on the road when I found out. Not sure accurate this is.

    Roaman, I rememeber that.

  45. Wrap, Are you a Hawks fan? Some people cant answer that.

    I am not sure what better for the lines but the most important thing is we have more then 12 good forwards now and we can roll 4 lines again. Fukking Yes.

    Something about 20 65 ? line, is good vibes.

  46. Opening night lineup of the 2018/19 season – a 4-3 OT win over Ottawa.

    Cat-Toews-Kahun
    Saad-Schmaltz-Kane
    Kunitz-Anisimov-Kampf
    Johnson-Kruger-Martinsen

    Keith-Jokiharju
    Gustafsson-Seabrook
    Manning-Rutta

    Ward/Delia

    Projected opening night lineup of the 2019/20 season:

    Sikura-Toews-Kane
    Cat-Strome-Kubalik
    Saad-Dach-Shaw
    Caggiula-Kampf-Carpenter/Perlini

    Keith-Gustafsson
    deHaan-Murphy
    Maatta-Seabrook

    Crawford/Lehner

    Differences:

    Forwards out: Schmaltz, Kahun, Anisimov, Martinsen, Kruger, Kunitz, Johnson
    Forwards in: Strome, Kubalik, Dach, Shaw, Sikura, Caggiula, Carpenter

    D-men out: Rutta, Manning, Jokiharju
    D-men in: Murphy, deHaan, Maatta

    Goalies out: Ward, Delia
    Goalies in: Crawford, Lehner

    Yep … much better.

  47. One mid range sslary will have to be moved to fill out roster before season starts, unless ltir comes into play. Strome and Debrincat look at this point pretty certain to collect their performance bonuses in 2.6m range, so another mid range contract needs moved so no overages into next season. Could be now, during season, tdl or just before July 1st but be a dump no return much after season.
    So don’t think roster is set in stone just yet. May be a few surprises before opening night to come yet.

  48. Lot of presumption that Anisimov will be gone. But honestly who wants the remaining contract commitment on a 31 year old Center who has declined precipitously? I think he’s going to be tough to move.

  49. Bowman saying he could be over the cap until opening of season, sounds like the possibility of ltir to me could be in play. Which would eliminate the need to make cap dump before then, when be no leverage to move someone from.

  50. Ltir could be nothing more than Dehaan start the season on there and buy some time to work roster out, not necessarily somebody done for year.

  51. Could be:
    Keith Gus
    Murphy Seabrook
    Maatta Joki
    Dehaan ltir to start season and see what happens from there

  52. EB, I like to distribute some weight to each line. So Saad on the first with Shaw to disturb the defenseman might open up more points for Captain my Captain.

    Perlini with DCat and Strome. I think this will be a good ole boys line that looks like it’s having fun out there. Building great chemistry every time it goes out on the ice. You can make it a number three line if it scores more than the others to mess up other teams defenseman match ups.

    Kubalik Dach Kane. Kane can play with anyone. Thinking here is Kuba and Dach could grow together (or Dach &Sikura or Dach & ……. or Dach &…….)

    Best fourth line was Islanders fourth line. Can we get that! ? Guess not but a mix of Caggulia Carpenter Kampf Quenneville could do.

  53. Love all the speculation-Jeremy Colliton and Marc Crawford will have LOTS to look at come September which is ahelluva lot better than last year.
    Staying healthy will also be #1 goal!
    The central division will still be tough- although each team lost some key pieces, except maybe the Stanley Cup champs.

  54. Ian, Bowman did say that wks ago so you didnt know what would happen but he has done everything and done exactly what is wanted for roster for this draft ufas summer you could want and need but he did it without giving away Anything for the future young wave.

    Everything that Bowman and crew have done this summer isnt messing with prospects. It sets us up to have a full and deep roster before they all get NHL ready. So were not fishing when there here and at that moment in time cant get who we want or need.

    Ahead of the crowded lines. We paid our dues for two yrs so we deserve this slamdown. Didnt people here say last summer that the Blackhawks would be ready and pounce on it this summer.

  55. Yea, for the division it looks like the top teams the last 2 yrs got worse and the other 5 got better. Makes it, almost, a even 7 teams accross the board, for this yr. But COL and CHI are on way up to the top and should be the top teams in conference in a couple yrs.

    2021 Baby!

    2 yrs were deep.

  56. O6 – My comment was in reply to Hull who seems to think everything is simple. Have we done a good job of developing goalies? The answer is no. However you can still acquire one by trade or free agency. I don’t really care how it is done. We signed Lehner for one year which should greatly strengthen our goaltending. We should be a much better team for 2019-20 than we were the last two years – that is very positive. At the end of the year we need to resolve the goalie issue but if Lehner has a good year it seems likely that he will be offered a multi-year deal. You want to rate SB on his ability to draft and develop players. I want to rate him based on the team he puts on the ice. Show me a GM who has won multiple cups that hasn’t made some mistakes. Oops, I forgot that all the good moves were due to Tallon (the guy who just signed a questionable goalie for $70m – and you thought Seabs contract was bad!).

  57. Correct me if I’m wrong on this – but it’s my understanding that a player can’t be put on LTIR until after opening day, which means the team must be cap compliant on opening day before being allowed to move the player off the active roster and n to LTIR. So in the case of the Hawks moving deHaan to LTIR to start the season – they would need to be cap compliant on opening day WITH deHaan’s $4.55M counting on the cap. They can then move him to LTIR and get up to $4.55M LTIR cap relief.

  58. Puck, I don’t think it’s a matter of being in the opening lineup or not – it’s a matter of being on the NHL roster and deHaan is currently on the Hawks’ NHL roster.

    It’s the same situation we had with Hossa – the Hawks had to be compliant with Hossa counting against the cap on opening day until he could be put on LTIR after passing cap compliant muster on opening day.

    Or maybe I have that incorrect?

  59. EB they can do season opening ltir and do it at end of training camp too. Similar to what they did with Rozival and Tootoo, vs Hossa who was opening day. If it is season opening they can exceed cap by calculated amount, if in season, done on opening day they have to be compliant first.
    There are issues with season opening because if caphit of player is higher than amount your over, then the difference is subtracted from cap ceiling to get the new limit they would need to be below to accrue daily capspace if player returns. Ideally if they could sign Perlini for 1.3m and recall Sikura or similar hit and send Delia down, swap Koekkoek for Dach same hit. That would give them 13f 7d 2g and be compliant. Then opening say put Dehaan on ltir, recall Joki for him and do a paper move of Kubalik to Ahl and recalled next day. Then have ltur space until Dehaan came back if needed and figure out who they want. Just if moving mid range contract makes more sense later than now, an option.

  60. They were able to exceed cap by about 1.2m on opening day wuth Rozival and Tootoo, then they used in season on Hossa on opening day.

  61. Ian, thanks for the explanation … but I must confess I’m still confused – I have some kind of mental block with the whole LTIR thing. But, it doesn’t matter so long as it works for the Hawks.

  62. I also don’t know if they would even use LTIR on de Haan – if he goes LTIR he’s obligated to miss a certain number of games or weeks and if he’s close to being ready to return they may just put him on IR which has no cap impact

    Even if they don’t trade AA before opening day they can be cap compliant although it won’t give them much flexibility during the season

    It seems the AA will eventually go (or perhaps Murphy if no takers for AA) whether it’s during the summer or after the season starts likely the former IMO

  63. Wrap ltir is 10 games probably not an issue, be up before end of October. If they don’t wouldn’t have room to recall a replacement for Dehaan if they don’t move a contract. Kind of wonder if Murphy isn’t moved too at some point, seems to be most likely and maybe easiest and best return to do.

  64. MS, you beat me to it about Tallon’s insane contract for (soon to be 31 year-old) Bobrovsky. He uses the 13th pick for super stud Spencer Knight who will probably be ready to step in as a #1 in 3-4 years. Then an aging Bobrovsky will be paid $7M for several years as a backup. Here is a good analysis:

    https://nhl.nbcsports.com/2019/07/01/panthers-take-huge-risk-on-bobrovsky-7-years-70m/

    FL will soon be up against the cap for years to come. Tallon and Q will never win a cup in FL. Tallon left Bowman in cap hell. Bowman did plenty to continue the problem, but he has learned. Will take him over Tallon any day.

    Last season Lehner was much better than Bobrovsky. Let’s hope that if Lehner plays well he will be a Blackhawk for several more seasons.

  65. O6 – I forgot about drafting Spencer Knight which makes the Bob signing even crazier. A small correction to your post – Bob would be a $10m backup not $7m!

  66. MS, I got the term and AAV mixed up. $10M for 7 years. I just read articles on winners and losers. Surprisingly, not one comment on drafting Knight. He didn’t get picked extremely high with the expectation of many years of development.

  67. Thanks to the people, Ian and others, who explain these rules and other things. Makes this blog one of the two best because you know the info is right / trust its right.

    I love Crow and like to see him resign for 2m and be good health wise. I also like Lehner to do very good be the starter for going forward for yrs, being 27 and lots of prime yrs. He might be the best goalie available and we could have during these important 8 coming yrs of 19 88.

  68. What team had same promblem with two good goalies and no takers, VAN. That better not come around and Bob or Spencer go to VAN. They could be good in future.

  69. With the trade of Darling to Florida, it looks like his hockey days are over. I wish the guy well. He was a great addition to the Blackhawks and a great story. Things appeared to not work out for him on and off the ice in Carolina, and he had to take leave.

    The move to Florida is for the purposes of a buyout by the Panthers. It looks like he will have a buyout that, cap-wise, hits Florida for about 1.25MM on average for the next four years. So Florida is paying Bob, gets a late round pick, and about 4.5 to 5 MM to be hit with on the cap over four years.

    Again, best wishes and good thoughts to Scott Darling going forward.

  70. Rangers and Senators need a Center badly. Take a look at their depth chart on Cap Friendly. In fact, you would think the Rangers would be willing bring Anisimov in to play with Panerin.
    Also, Ottawa has a boatload of 2nd and 3rd round picks over the next two years. Anisimov would immediately be their 2nd line Center at worst.

  71. We all wish Darling well. I’m not as smart as someone like Hull65 but why take on the cap hit after Carolina already bought him out? They also have the recapture penalty for Luongo.

  72. The trade means that Florida will buyout Darling’s contract and receive a 6th rd pick next year. Meanwhile, they unload Reimer’s more expensive contract to make room for Bobrovsky. Carolina wanted Reimer as a backup.

  73. Yeah, I think Original6 is correct. Florida takes on the whole Darling contract, and is thus obliged to be the one to buy him out. Florida wants Bob badly enough that they move Reimer and take on the Darling buyout/cap hit along with it. It’s still a cap hit, but it’s staggered over four years. I think what I saw was 3 of the years are at a little over 1MM, and 1 year was for about 2MM.

  74. Hull don’t know either why Lehner didn’t resign. Goalies are notorious headcases and Lamareillo isn’t known for patience. As long as he performs on the ice and has his personal issues resolved we should all be happy. Don’t think this was a targeted signing but somebody the organization had looked at as a player they would like in the fold for the future and possibly be a trade target. When he became available and fell into their lap, i think Bowman and company felt they needed to move, especially with the luxury of Delia not needing to clear waivers. I’m sure an extension will happen.

  75. Orig6- I considered that but thought Reimer isn’t that bad and his contract wasn’t that bad. And after checking, Florida saves a little over $2 million for one year and a little over $1 million the next but the next two years take on $1.183 million for two years. Total savings are about $867k.

  76. Lou offered offered Lehner a 2 year $5 mill per contract and Lehner asked to think about it – when he came back in two (and was going to accept) Lou had moved on to Varly leaving Lehner out in the cold – that’s Lehner’s story anyway – seems likely especially considering Lou

  77. Good idea for 15 to go to NYR and be with 72. He was there before. That would have things are coming around.

    20 and 65 and 32/23 are back home.

  78. Wrap, thanks. Just read that Lehner said he received an ultimatum of a couple of hours. He said they offered him two years and he wanted a longer term. My guess is that the Islanders were afraid they would lose both Lehner and Varlamov if they didn’t move quickly. They were probably hesitant to give Lehner more term because of his substance abuse history. Hopefully, Bowman extends him early next year if he plays at a high level.

    Question for Hull65: Which GM made the better decision in signing a goalie. yesterday, Tallon or Bowman?

  79. Trading 15 is a problem. I’ve been saying for months that they are going to have to throw in another player/prospect/pick. Other teams know the cap predicament the Hawks are now in which gives them leverage. Expect to be disappointed with this trade.

  80. Original, We both know a team that gave up draft picks to pick up a 3.9 million dollar contract of an injury prone player.
    There has to be at least one more dumb GM out there like Bowman.

  81. Original just saw a proposed trade on twitter with Columbus. Crawford to fill their void now in goal and Anisimov who Torts likes for draft picks. 4th next year and 2nd in 21.

  82. Do not be surprised to see Corey Crawford put on LTIR and to have his “final skate” moment next April or May.

  83. Once again, waiting too long to trade Anisimov and now we will throw in Beaudin to get rid of a contract!!! Why?

  84. Were not trading a Four Horsemen to trade 15. Only 7 caphit would be worth that. 15 can just be buyout for 1 yr or just have one of the 5m or 6m goalies for 21 season.

    Keeping every young wave player unless its to add a good player.

  85. I like keeping Crow for 1 or 2 yrs at 2m kind of caphit and going with Lehner for the coming yrs for 4-5 yrs at similiar caphit he has now. Whats fair in terms of that. Thats right there is 3m savings and 15 is what 4.5m, we can make it work and keep every young wave player.

  86. We do not have to keep 5 4 44 for there enitre contracts yrs. Theres plenty there to take from when we need.

  87. Great signing in the sense that we might mask our deficiencies on the back end.

    I see 9 D. 4 are middle pairing guys if I’m being kind. 4 are bottom pair guys or worse on most good teams. Joker is the closest thing we have to a top pair guy. Seems like he will start the year in Rockford. That’s outrageous.

    The back end looks weak af. Lehner might help that, as well as expected PK and defensive forward improvements. But we need at least another upgrade on the backend, or an unexpected surprise from within. We might be ok without a top pair, but only if we compensate with defensive depth.

    Overall, a good off-season though. Hopefully it gets even better.

  88. Stape, I wasn’t happy with what we gave up for Shaw, but he is much better than AA. AA is also injury prone

    Hull65 is right. Waited too long to trade AA and his stock keeps dropping. If Bowman throws in Beaudin, this is another FAIL. Is this going to go like throwing in Teuvo to move Bickell? Or Johns to move Sharp?

  89. I agree JT! Strange Lehner is not in Long Island.
    Sorry Ian, but having Kampf as a number 3 center is not a good sign. For me, he and Sikura do not make the opening night roster. They make it in Rockford but not in Chicago.
    And if AA is traded, Dach makes the team as a #3 center while Carpenter slots in at # 4. If AA stays, Dach plays right wing.
    Bruins had Bergeron, Kreci, Coyle and Acciari at center. Kampf is no where close to someone like Coyle. Blues had Bozek. Kampf is a call up at best.
    Hey MS, I am happy Bowman drafted Dach, remember? Complaining about Perlini? No but he should have been signed way before Sikura but that’s Bowman still trying to believe his own hype and turn Sikura into a top 6 player. Develop Perlini instead.
    Would have been nice to sign 27 year old Dzingel now at a lower cost and still have some cap room. Let’s see if Bowman pulls the trigger with Murphy. Many teams need a bottom 5-6 dman who shoots right (Jets).

    Perlini Toews Kane
    Saad Anisimov Dach
    Dcat Strome Kubalik
    Caggiula Carpenter Shaw

    Keith Seabs
    DeHaan Gus
    Maatta Joki

  90. Yeah we could be, until some Horsemen get to top pair quality, fine with deep balance. 5 2nd pair Defensemen and a 3rd pair guy. Thats all that VEG had and they had balance. Once the Four Horsemen are playing Buck and Bo could be #2 then we would have 4 # 2nd pair guys and 2 #2 guys.

    We be deeper then 2010 and 2013 and 2015 just not have #1 D guy.

  91. Travis, defensive depth is what we will have and it get better as Horsemen come in.

    For this off season getting even better, can since we can go over the cap by 8.1m until game 1. Haan is ltir and maybe another.

  92. One thing is noticeably different seeing the names on the 23man now compared to the last two yr. Meat and Potatoes. Holy shit when did we get so many bigger and tuff all of sudden. Looks more like the 2009 and 2010 teams now then it did last OCT.

  93. I agree Mo the future is bright on the backend but next year’s corps as it stands is underwhelming.

    Not willing to mortgage the future for help right now. Glad we didn’t sign a top FA defenseman. Smart to compensate with defensive forwards and Lehner. De Haan helps. Need at least one more move. Maatta is probably not the answer.

    Come on Stan make a good off-season an outstanding one.

  94. Travis remember everybody saying similar things about Isles last year, they went from worst defensive team to best defensive team last season. They did with a new system and without changing any defensemen on their roster at all.

  95. Hull not my opinion on Kamof your disagreeing with, i’m going on what Sharps opinion was if you put him with some good linemates he will do fine, he’s young, give him a chance.

  96. Yea, I want roster better then it is now. We do have that coming with blue chip prospects and other moves.

    We are though Way better then the last two yrs. We were a playoff team last yr but still not deep roster last yr and would not have won like STL did because even though they sucked more then we did, thay at least had a full roster since july 1 last yr. We had, a better roster a 3/4 roster since around game 30 adjustmants.

    So even though they did it they were really deep from the start. Were wernt last yr but now where close to deep though. I still want it better, even though young wave is coming. We can beat the top teams now with having a full roster this yr. I still want it a little better to be able to beat 4 good teams though.

    The division is deepest again but this yr the 20 season its really even. The top teams NAS WIN got worse and every other team got better so could be 7 team tie, in a way. From the 21 season and on were really deep. That is how STL won, because they were deep at every position not because they were better quality players then BOS. Thats what we kind of have for this season. Then will have the better quality from 21 and on.

    This is a long post that has a point / overall idea in it somewhere.

  97. What I love is were adding what we need now, before the young wave comes in. That way as these guys come in these next two yrs were already deep and ready to go. Not having to try to find what we need and then something we need or want isint available then and were waiting, at the wrong time. Bowman and crew are ahead of the crowd thats waiting in line.

    Everything since 4/9 draft lottery top 3 pick, has gone our way. Every top 5 team got much worse and other top teams stayed same and some others got better like us. What we have and no other really good team has, other then COL, is a wave of blue chip players coming. So we could be very good this yr but man are we good 21 and on. I can see us doing what Islanders or Carolina did this yr, except were going to sky rocket after this yr to a top team.

    Doing what we did in 2009 this yr would be good experience and what the younger guys need to do, in order to really be ready to win again in the coming yrs. We got a bunch of good runs coming to win two more Cups not just one.

  98. Ian I’ve heard that too. Analytics say it’s due to luck. A PDO of 102 is very high over 82 games. 5v5 save percentage of 94%. It’s likely that the isles improved defensively with the same personnel. The worst to first narrative, though, is misleading. Luck had a big part of it.

  99. Travis a luck over a whole season, game in game out. I think it takes a whole lot more than luck to do that. Every teams success has luck you can cherry pick, Blues hiring Berube and him taking a chance 4th string goalie, you could say winning cup was all luck.

  100. AA will not be hard to move. Would you want a big center for 2.27mil? Would you like to save 2.27mil off the cap? I bring up that I wouldn’t mind Turris or Lucic or who ever for half so why wouldn’t some team like AA for half? (NYR). It is only for 2 yrs. I wouldn’t want to do that for Seabs deal. A sweetener will be needed for Seattle to take him.
    Is it within the rules to trade a player and have the other team take the caphit and for the trading team pay the salary?(Ott)

  101. JR, short answer no. What ever % of salary you pay/retain up to 50% allowed, the same % of caphit stays too.

  102. “Other teams know the cap predicament the Hawks are now in”

    Honestly, where in the sweet hell does this stuff even come from? 2014? The Blackhawks have an overstuffed roster & $1M in cap space but we’re still banging the “Hawks can’t afford it under the cap” drum? Really? Come on folks. We’ve gotta be better than that in 2019. The Chicago Blackhawks just addressed almost every need and added three players making > $4M per in areas of need and we’re crying poor.

    There are still free agents who haven’t signed. There are still teams making interesting/fairly significant deals. There are other teams (see: Carolina) who are actually cap-strapped (and allegedly cash poor) who NEED to dump salary who are legitimately desperate to make a deal. Teams will line up to take advantage of the Canes or Leafs before they’ll make a deal that, in theory, works for both sides with a team like Chicago.

  103. We all know that the next move will be trade …with no cap space the hawks still have a few cards in their hand ..let see iff they can play them and find a way to get better

  104. I believe we’re in a great position. AA for Ryan and Ott retain half of Ryan probably gets them to the floor. That should leave enough for a 1yr flyer for Dzingel. Then we’ll be loaded.

  105. Original, Why pick up anyone who is injury prone unless you are getting a discount?
    AA should have been traded earlier when his trade value was higher.
    Dzingle or even Hartman could have been picked up for about half of 3.9
    million without losing a second and third round pick. Simmons signed for 5
    million. Hawks should be trying to add picks instead of trying to find ways
    to trade them away.

  106. Count me in the camp that doesn’t want to see Kampf at 3C. I think Kampf makes a fine 4C but nothing I’ve seen from him makes me think he can be the center of a line we need to score more often than a 4th line. Maybe he has more of an offensive game than he’s shown so far, and I hope he does – but I hope he shows it as the 4C.

    In fact, for as much abuse as Sikura gets in certain quarters, I’ll state that if Sikura plays as many games as Kampf, Sikura will have close to a 2 x 1 scoring advantage.

  107. Tab agree Balackhawks have lots of options, looking good, all good come fall.

    I don’t get this Canes cap strapped at all. With all there top 6 fwds signed, top 4 D signed and 2 goalies, they still have over 11 m in space with rfas Forsling and Fleury to round out D and Mcginn plus Bishop none big contracts and one or 2 probably low end deal, depth spots. Cash flow quite possible but ton of capspace for their needs.

  108. AA should not be difficult to move and certainly will not require a “sweetener” like Beaudin – that’s actually laughable. AA will score 15 – 20 goals and has good size. We have paid $2m of his cash comp for this year so a buyer saves some cash as well. The really interesting question is would we consider moving Crow? I don’t see this being done until training camp when teams see that his health is ok but assuming that it is I could definitely see interest from other teams in a very solid goalie on a one year deal. The question for me would be what would you do with the space that this opened.

  109. EB considering Sikura mostly got linemates who can bring offense i would agree he should. Considering Kampf played most games with Kruger, Hayden and Kunitz, i would like as too see to Sharps point that be an apples to apples, discussion to make sure before writing him off.

  110. Sikura doesn’t do much for me. Seems like a Rockford shuttle type in the big picture.

  111. I think Kampf would have to show a bit of offensive talent as a 4C before he’s seriously tried as a 3C

    Occasionally even with Kruger/Kunitz etc. Kampf would get his chances and he consistently did little with those chances whether that meant he bobbled the puck off his stick or that he shot wide or high or tried to force a pass that wasn’t there

    Those attributes don’t have to do with his line mates those are on him

    He has managed to create some chances for himself but until he makes something of those chances he’s a 4C IMO albeit a good 4C which is why I think he belongs there at the present

  112. Hull65, you projected the following lines scenario;

    Perlini Toews Kane
    Saad Anisimov Dach
    Dcat Strome Kubalik
    Caggiula Carpenter Shaw

    Keith Seabs
    DeHaan Gus
    Maatta Joki

    I’m not disagreeing with your thought process here, but I don’t think it matches now with what Stan and Colliton “appear” to be thinking. I think that both Carpenter and Shaw are slotted at center regardless of AA being traded or not. Crowded mix perhaps, but Stan seemed to be emphatic that a centerman would be brought in to take the load off of Toews, and AA doesn’t fit that role. I think Bowman is trying to be stronger up the middle and AA is an odd man out. I have always like AA’s game, though, as he has been one of the few to go to the net.

    I also even wonder if Perlini will be signed now. I think he would have to show a whole lot more than he did last season to warrant a spot on the top line. He’s got great speed and could be developed, but I don’t know that his development fits in with the moves that have been made thus far.

    I’m also pretty sure that Seabrook will be paired with Maata/DeHaan on a regular basis. Stan has already said that. I think Keith will be primarily paired a younger guy.

    But, hey, there are still moves to be made.

  113. Ian/Travis, wasnt following what your talking about but for Lehner someone here, ER?, posted he had really good save % 2 of 3 yrs before on a shht team. So BUF might have prob gave up a lot of shots and it helped that % and NYI had a Trotz system thats good about defense. THough I am not sure if Trotz system gives up lots, medium, or low abmount of shots. Thing is even if padded by total amount of shots on two different kinds of teams, he still had that good % for 3 of 4 yrs which is why I feel really good about this.

    On last two yrs rosters for us, yea I do not think it matters whos in net. With who we have now D and FW its way different and going forward were just quality deep where now were good deep.

  114. ER, thing is Carpenter is 52.5 faceoffs so he has to play center right. Unless the switch after draw. You do have that right left thing.

    \64 plays 3rd temporarily is fine and rather him be 4th as well.

    Thats another thing nobody has talked about having this many more right hand shot FW since we added all these good role players. I am going to look at the 2009 and 2010 teams and see how many we had then left and right and what we have now.

  115. Wrap thats similar to what i felt on Kampf too, always said his versatility was more valuable than his short comings are a liability. Just that Sharp who i look at somebody who not only played with him but is very knowledgrable too, saw him as being a good 3rd center given the opportunity, so i kinda went with that over my own opinion.

  116. Good point, theres more ‘dominos to go’ before thsoe kind of moves can happen.

    I see 64 scoring the kind of goals Krugs and Frozal did on game 4 agasint BOS. When we took it to them and lead the whole way, and even a crazy bounce not lucky crazy bounce came over the top of the net right in front where they had a guy and we didnt? wtf is that? Where 16 and 67 were on a odd man rush, for playing good D, and took a shot that was saved then Krugs got the rebound and out it in. THose kind of goals. For the record by the way that game should havnt ever been tied at 5 should have been 7-4 kind of score.

    Point there is, you have to have a quality 4th line of players. A whole line that can work together like that and make those kind of goals happen, when theres times like that, like that one on that game 4.

  117. Indian, thats what I think. It would be sweet to have 20 19 65 or all the options with 20 and 65 on 3rd for balanced line.

    Until 77 is center ready for 82 games, Shawzer the 3rd line center like he was in 2013, the yrs he was here.

  118. Ian 20 bucks says Isles not top 10 GA this regular season. We can renegotiate at playoff time re colorado

  119. Travis, I think that because in addition to your reason, every team that has a good yr in a somewhat surpise kind of way then has not as good the next yr. Everybody plays a harder game agasint them the next 82 games. It happened to DAL, then COL (pixie dust yr)(there not pixie dust now though), then NAS, then EDM, then VEG, then NYI?, someone is next?

    These teams kind of get out to that standard patent 30-10 kind of record, it almost happens every yr someone does that.

  120. Dzingel is a slightly better version of Stalberg. Not understanding people’s insistence to trade Anisimov for that. If you’re going to trade go for it all and get a team need (Werenski)). Our offense was fine

  121. Don’t think AA would be traded and then Dzingel signed unless he signs for 1 year only which I highly doubt

    Next year CC, Lehner and Gus come off the books – that $12.2 million and let’s say the cap goes up by $2 mil – that’s now $14.2 mil

    Dcat and Strome are probably gonna be around $12 mil combined

    That only leaves $2.2 to resign Lehner for something about $7 mil

    If you get AA’s $4.5 off the books by then you’ve got $6.7 mil for Lehner and no more so someone else (Murphy? Perlini? Saad? Shaw? Maatta?) will likely go as well

    You’ve got Joki to replace Murphy and Dach to replace AA so IMO trading those two could happen anytime and IMO at least one this summer

  122. Salary cap goes up 2.5m and Lehner gets 6m for however many yrs.

    I like Crow staying until he retires at around 2m caphit and short yrs at a time.

    15 and whoever else arnt staying after 21 no matter what.

    When you think of how many options we have with these caphit numbers and players on 23man, were good because of all the options we have. Were not backed in a corner, were just full with still 1m in capspace with room to get more space.

    Just adding not disagreeing to your post there.

  123. I would say by everyones overall ideas and thoughts that Maata or Murf are traded at some point, maybe both. We Four Horsemen coming and are going to be very good players. Even if two of them are only as good as 5 and 4 are thats fine because Buck and Bo are going to both be #2 or a 2 and a 3.

    We could add a Defensemen thats a #1 by trade or ufa in the coming summers, its not like were not allowed to just not most ideal caphit wise. We can do that though. This summer isint yet but I think we do that its in the coming summers.

  124. Tab, $1M in cap space is not much when taking into account signing Perlini now and needing to re-sign DCat, Strome, and, if all goes well, Lehner. No more $1M goalie rentals. This means trading AA and one or more of KK, Dahl, Gus, possibly Murphy. This gives other teams some leverage. An example is TOR needing to include their 2020 1st rd pick in order to move Marleau to CAR to free up cap space. Teams know how to negotiate based on each other’s cap strengths and weaknesses, and after all of the trades and signings the Hawks made, they are not exactly dealing from strength.

  125. I am for Lehner 6m and Crow 2m going forward, with both being healthy and still good.

    Right hand shots
    2009- 6 FW 2 D
    2010- 5 FW 2 D

    2019- 2 FW 3 D
    2020- 4 FW 3 D

    Need one more right hand shot at FW, then were good.

  126. PK faceoffs

    2019
    19- 52.2.5%
    16- 44%
    15- 42.5%
    64- 40.5%

    19- 52.25%
    40- 51.75%

    Wonder what 65 faceoffs are every yr and PK every yr?

  127. Shawzer was around 45 % 4 of 5 first yrs.
    Then was 50% or 55 % 4 of last 5 yrs.

    So better now and around 50% or better so thats 3 guys right there compared to 1 the last two yrs. Major difference. Would like one more faceoff guy at deadline in the coming yrs.

  128. @STAPE 10:03 am
    We agree on wishing the Hawks didn’t take the risk on an injury-prone player like Shaw (they did the same with Maatta and De Haan) and parting with next year’s 2nd rd pick. However, when healthy he is more valuable than Dzingle or Hartman. They are 4th line while Shaw is 3rd line who can also fill in on 2nd line. I posted in the Shaw thread that he needs to adjust his game, He plays much larger for his size. It may mean less hard checking and going to the net in heavy traffic.

  129. I am for adding a good player like Dzingle to be loaded not instead of someone else.

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  131. @ORIGINAL6HAWKEY

    My point was I would rather have have signed Dzingle or Hartman at 2 million a season.
    Then we would have still had the 2nd and 3rd round draft picks that we gave away to get Shaw and his 3.9 million dollar contract.
    Shaw is the best of the three if he is healthy problem is he cannot stay healthy.
    I predict 60 games a season for Shaw he is damaged goods in my humble opinion.
    Might as well have went after Simmons for 5 million.
    Giving up the second and third round pick is not good at all.
    Montreal is accumulating a lot of draft picks and in the end it will pay off large.
    Smart GMs try to add picks not give them away.

  132. Stape – like you said neither Dzingel or Hartman is the player Shaw is (besides pretty sure Dzingel is gonna be more than $2 mil) and Stan gave back less than he got when he traded away Shaw

    He used one of two 2nd rounders he got from trading Shaw to draft DCat and now he gets Shaw back as an improved player for less in terms of draft picks – that’s a win and that’s how smart GM’s operate

    Shaw has had some injuries – who hasn’t including Toews – you take your chances in a contact sport – I’m happy with Shaw over either of the other two – he’s a winner and a leader and a better player

    The window is closing for T and K – Shaw can help win possibly another Cup while those draft picks might one day win a Cup it likely won’t be with T and K

  133. Not disagreeing specifically but 2nd and 3rd picks when we got 2nd and 2nd for the same player to get by for salary cap. Debrincat. Thats a given to say.

    People need to, let it go. We already used a bunch of picks to get Schmaltz/Strome Debrincat the Four Horsemen Dach Vlasic.

    Now its time to get deep and play because were not getting a top 8 or top 3 pick again for 10 yrs. Those were are only two, like 06 and 07. I think same it goos to have more 2nds and 3rds but for those two specific picks we got 2nd and 2nd 2-3 yrs ago and are developed already.

    At some point you have to add good players and not picks. Were at that point with not getting another top 8 or top 3 pick again for 10 yrs. That is the tipping point, just like it was with 4 and 81.

  134. We do not miss out on 2nds and 3rds anyways because we get players like Rasmoose Bread Man Kopecky Kahun Kubalik and keep them coming.

    We have good scouts thats why.

  135. The defense has been improved. The goaltending is improved. Shaw improves team defense, grit and versatility. We are better now than last year. And there seems to be a bunch of people here that believe Joki is our true top pair guy next year – I gotta say that a half season in the bigs and then being sent down because he didn’t belong here (despite a good tournament mid year) yet tends to lean me in the direction of it being unlikely his play will be top line quality next season. For me, 2021 is a stretch. We are not going to grow a true (one that could be a top pair guy on most other teams in the league) top pair defender without being patient and suffering through a lot of mistakes. Byram was a shot at a quicker fix, and we passed to fill another need. I think there is a plan for a top guy, but we don’t have the cap space for that now without some major moves.

    Without a true top pair, or even a single player capable of a true top pair, we are at best a one-and-done Stanley Cup contender. Personally, if we were not going to obtain enough to make us a stronger contender, then I would have preferred we didn’t throw ourselves into the mix for a wild card spot. I’d prefer getting into the lottery again and hoping for some dumb luck 2 years in a row. I understand the need to put a reasonable team on the ice, but for the long term – we go nowhere without a true top pair.

    Better draft picks at least would have given us some leverage for trades. We are better. Just not nearly good enough to compete for the cup.

    We are going to have at least Colorado in our way for many years to come. Don’t know when their cap hell will arrive, but wow – are they ever in a good position for a few years.

    Still think there are more changes to come. We may not like some of them either. You gotta give up quality to get quality.

  136. BOS has there young players now. COL has some more coming. CHI only has 12 and 40 games of 27. Once the entire young wave is on 23man were there with those teams. BOS only has one top pair D guy and they are good. I do not know but we prob have two #2 and four #3 and #4 for the group. No#1 but no 3rd pair D. Good deep balance. We still could add a #1 D guy, I mean TB got one fro NYR at deadline, we could do that on one of the yrs coming.

  137. I do agree were not there yet, roster wise. With who we have now and the entire group of young wave players coming, then I think were top team again.

  138. I not sure what the reason is but if we wanted Byram Bowman and crew would have picked him. So hey must have a plan or not worried about #1 Defensemen. Otherwise why would we not pick him. He might only be as good as Buck or Bo or not that much better. Where Dach they think will be better. It doesnt make any sense why they would do that if they didnt know things we do not.

  139. Teams in last 4 yrs that have won didnt have that good of D group, so may be the new way of the league. Idnk.

  140. Stape, we both flinched over the Shaw trade for two decent picks. Blocks bringing up a prospect for a good portion of the season. But he returns more skilled and is a very good all-around player. If he plays 70 games, he will contribute at least 40 points and make things miserable for opponents. Maybe Sikura and Perlini will learn something from him and stop playing scared. Hartman is still young but is coming off a bad season and is being passed around like a deck of cards. Red flag.

  141. Not trying to go agasint people thoughts on not being good enough, for specific reason why. Other then getting a #1 Defensemen like GTB not sure where you get one from. Byram is top pair Dach is 1st line center. There has to be reason why we didnt pick Byram, it must be would rather have 1st line center more and 5 #2 and #3 kind of D. Deep and balanced.

    TB did get a #1 and didnt win. So maybe 5 good D is better then 3 really good ones. I have no idea just that we could add one like TB did or go with the new flow of more at once of 2s and 3s.

  142. Simmonds is good but guys on team might not play for him more. Guys on team will play for Shawzer. Simmonds is 1 yr? get him next summer and have both. Use 15 caphit cap space. Were not keeping 5 4 and 44 long term, maybe 1 of them so theres 9m right there.

    No matter what way we do it, theres lots and lots of cap space to use by trading someone. Bowman and crew will finetune each yr accordingly.

  143. Shaw adds an element to the roster thats needed, he’s a known commodity. Dzingel will likely sign for closer to 4m than 2m plus want some term, doesn’t fit next year and why did Columbus sign Nyqvist instead. Hartman’s stock is low and finding it hard to stick with a team. So glad he went after Shaw over those 2. Don’t like giving up picks but provably feels he can get a couple back with moves he will eventually maje before next summer, sooner or later.

  144. As far saying the defense doesn’t have what is needed, lets just see how full the glass is in for the future before we condemn it.

  145. Mo looking at your right shot and faceoff stats, what you’re saying is missing there has Reese Jihnsons nane written all over it. I know he’s an unknown who went undrafted because injuries slowed his draft years but hes has potential to be a real bottom 6 contributor. Another greasy 2way hard to play against guy who can bring some offense and take big faceoffs.

  146. @Wraparound. Correct. This is the point:

    “The window is closing for T and K – Shaw can help win possibly another Cup while those draft picks might one day win a Cup it likely won’t be with T and K.”

    Draft picks can’t help, but productive 2-way players can. Stan has done extremely well addressing team needs very efficiently and cost effectively. Just an A++ effort so far.

  147. There has only been one undrafted free agent European player that has made it big in the NHL and his name is PANARIN. He and Kane were the most dynamic duo for two seasons in the entire league. Until our GM had a nervous breakdown and traded him. The Kahuns, Rutta, Wedin, Kampfs of the world are fringe NHLers. No impact.
    The Hawks have a better team than last year on paper because they have been replaced by NHL calibre players. The gamble Bowman has taken is each of one of these players he has signed (Shaw, Maatta, Da Haan, Lehner) have had health issues their entire career. (except for Carpenter, a 4th line player). Love Shaw but he is one concussion away from retiring. Maatta’s knees have slowed him down considerably. Da Haan’s a physical player but his shoulder issues are very worrisome. Lehner? He remains a big gamble in my opinion. Trotz’s system protects goalies and the Hawks as a team were almost dead last in each category last season. And if JC wants to continue coaching this one on one pursuit style team defence, well only Keith, Gus and maybe Joki can survive. DaHaan, Maatta, Murphy and Seabs are not fleet of foot. The forwards will need to commit defensively much more. I will be curious to see if Lehner can stay focused and produce another solid season under JC’s system and with a team who thinks offence first (not like the stay at home, dump and chase Trotz). I would have gambled on Lankinen while trading AA & Murphy and try to get Ehlers and a draft pick away from the Jets.

  148. Still, this team is better than last season. Do we have depth in case of injuries? Not really but I do like Entwhistle and Saarela as potential players. So, we can leave Sikura with his brother Tyler in Rockford. Why a 2 year contract,…not sure but Hawks can include him with AA or Murphy in an eventual trade. Hopefully Bowman can get one of those 2nd round picks back.

  149. “The window is closing for T and K – who cares?
    Shaw is not going to put Chicago over the top to win the Stanley cup!
    He might help them make the playoffs.
    The Hawks should be improved this year but win the cup??
    40/1 odds to win the cup
    Shaw is a winner you say….. Brandon Bollig is a winner as well.
    Building through the draft will be the backbone of the future for Chicago not picking up ex Hawks that Hawk fans will always love.
    Bowman’s fascination with ex Hawks is crazy!

  150. Using Bollig as comp for Shaw as a winner is not a good look

    Bollig got his name on the Cup for playing all of 5 playoff games in 2013 and playing very little in those 5 games

    Shaw won the Cup twice and played 46 combined playoff games in 2013 and 2015 playing an instrumental role both years

    As far as who cares if T and K’s window to win is closing – I think Hawks management cares, most Hawk fans care, I care and most of the posters on this blog care

    We care about trying to win another Cup with 19 and 88 – if it doesn’t happen so be it but I’d rather they make the effort than start accumulating draft picks on the assumption that they won’t win another Cup with T and K

    We can all agree that building through the draft is vitally important but the name of the game is still winning the Cup

  151. Prime yr players that were here before work well like Steeger and Shawzer. Its the ones that are 33 that do not like Odyua and Sharp and Soupy. Thats the difference. If Bread Man came back, he would automatically suck?

    This team was a playoff team after roster adjusments around game 30. Just were -9 game under .500 STL had was worse then 40/1 odds. Its not the odds its the roster and STL had a deep roster since july 1 that yr. We do not yet but it its close now.

    I would like to finetune and round off what we need but it cant be done overnight. Every move this draft trades ufas was a good one. Every top 5 team got worse. Ina couple yrs COL and CHI will be the top teams with the young wave of players both teams have. They are a yr ahead of us for younger players but they have no defense and goalie right now? They have two good Defensemen coming but arnt there yet like the Four Horsemen. All prob be there about same time.

    By the time were quality deep with the young players it be good timing as the better teams wont be as good anymore. The only reason why BOS is a top team again is because they still have half of there core. We have that 2 19 88 20.

  152. How do you win the Stanley Cup. You get rid of players like Hartman and get a Horsemen and Kurachev. You trade 65 when cap makes you and get Debrincat in the process because you make good out of bad. The picks just come round and round. 2nd 2nd for 2nd 3rd. Round and round.

    Whats left after the dust settles. Beau Kurachev and Debrincat and Sawzers back. Its all coming around.

  153. I’m really confused by about a half dozen posters here. EVERYONE here knows that being in cap hell is the death of a franchise. In a FA period where silly dollars have been tossed around, this GM behaves in a way to protect the cap and financial health of the franchise, addresses real problems on the roster with med-risk, high upside trades giving up little, does it with SIZE and GRIT (grrrrrrr), pulls together a Vezina-class G signing that could be game-changing on a one-year prove it-type deal, and somehow, I get the feeling the half dozen posters that confuse the hell out of me expected more.

    More of what?? In a climate of stupid dollars being thrown about?? What exactly and why better? Save the draft picks!!! Does anyone here pay attention to what Ryan Pace does with draft picks? They’re fungible and like currency for guys like him. They come and go, easily. Here and there, a deal may have been avail or missed, but this roster has just experienced significant turnover. Stan’s been busy and he isn’t standing around waiting. Instead, he’s trying to make things happen.

    I think people like being grumpy. Let’s let it play out. I’m eager to see the remaining tweaks.

  154. The T and K (and Cat) window remains the best oppty to hoist another cup. It’s asinine to ignore it and to hoard 2nds at the expense of it. Think about it…we have 2 top 3 draft picks on the roster, T and K both HOF players, and the argument is to waste the back-end of their prime years for a 2nd that might pan out in 2-4 years. Smart money and smart sense favors the T and K window.

  155. Two very good posts by Hull65, although I disagree on Lehner.

    1. Trading Panarin was in a panic. Bowman was afraid he would have to sign him for $6M AAV (back then was a good value). Had 74 points to Saad’s 53 when they were swapped. Shouldn’t mess with tremendous success with Kane.

    2. Shaw’s concussion history makes him too risky. To me, three years left on his contract and parting with a 2nd and 3rd not worth it. A greater risk than Maatta.

    3. Maatta injuries have slowed him down. Still a good defender with a high hockey IQ. Trading Kahun is not a big loss and probably worth the gamble.

    4. de Haan has had FOUR shoulder surgeries. Last season, in 74 games had just 14 points. Don’t expect him to remain healthy for long. Unless Saarela eventually makes the team, this is not a good trade.

    5. Lehner coming off a HOF year was an excellent signing. What’s the risk? Just one year. The greater risk would be losing him after a year when he no longer has substance abuse issues with many good years ahead of him.

  156. Stape the Blues were anywhere from 150 t0300-1 odds at midseason to win the cup. Wrap and Aurora agree with your posts, i’ve been saying all year its more important the that they try to win 19 and 88 sooner than later.

  157. Don’t see trading Panarin as a panic move at all. Panarin was signed by Bowman for 6m he wanted until became ufa. Bowman has always said don’t create a void to fill another. With Debrincat coming to fill the offensive need he rightly so, saw the defensive void Hossa left and moved to try to fill it with Saad.

    I don’t agree with every move he makes, as i i have said on the Joki handling, but having a high calibur defensenan available to play when injuries happen, certainly lessens the risk in taking Dehaan if he is limited. Find it hard to believe after reading all the posts railing against Forsling and Forsberg last couple of years that i’m actually reading getting Dehaan for them is a bad trade.

  158. Aurora Hawk – haters gonna hate and you’ll never please them. There will always be a would of, should of, could have. Stay positive. Go Hawks.

  159. Some observations re the new acquisitions and their injuries:

    Maatta: the risk here is more his play than recurring injuries. Good move.

    De Haan: shoulders are tricky. I think he is riskier than Maatta.

    Shaw: he needs to learn to protect himself (as Jonny did more of last year). Very high risk if he doesn’t do that. Some may disagree, but his skill level his high enough that he can still be effective without turning every shift into a war.

    Lehner: seriously, it’s a one year deal. If he pans out that could fill the top spot for the next 5 or 6 years. Potential reward far outweighs the risks. Another good move.

    I am a frequent Stan critic but I think he did well (hopefully with Carpenter too). My only concern is in getting both Maatta and De Haan. If it was only one, I think I would have gone with Maatta given his age and less extensive injury history.

  160. If Bowman going to clear some space, wonder how cheap he could get Gusev from Vegas, no room to sign him. Big scoring winger, say he was a better player in Khl than Panarin and Radulov. Be a ufa next year, likely sign for 1 year, if cost wasn’t to high. They could use nhl ready dman at under 1m caphit, Dahlstrom or Koekkoek maybe. Obviously gaining cap space involves other moves.

  161. Ian, I bet you didn’t bet a penny on St Louis winning the cup.
    Probably because you thought that St Louis had zero chance of winning the cup.

    When I give my opinion it is nothing more than an opinion.
    If you have a different opinion than I do that is fine.

    If you believe the Hawks can win the cup in the next two or three years in this supposed window I hope that you are right. Maybe you should drop a few bucks on the Hawks to win….I doubt any of you guys or girls will.

    I will guarantee you one thing. I will not be betting a penny on the Hawks winning the cup. Because I think their chances of winning the cup are next to zero.

    Shawsy must have been going in for a tuneup .. I ran into him at the chiropractor clinic today.

    Remember my prediction 60 games for Andrew this year.

  162. Ian, what do you like better for Buckaroo for development. Just play 9 games then stay in Rockford until this OCT.

  163. Everyone thought they were top 5 team after summer moves ufas they got. Then they were worse then us with full roster. I think everyone knew they were a top 5 ish team and was really surprised they were that bad first same 30 games. Thats why I care about the our roster and being deep and not other specifics. I want a depp roster, quality deep. If we keep 2nd and 3rd pick to load up half the core will be over the hill and then we would have to do that until Dach is 30.

  164. We do have 8.1 m and the 1 m cap space we have right now right? So we could add a little more then 9 m if we wanted.

  165. Were going to be good this yr but I think the top teams will play this yr, they didnt this yr here as they all got beat in first round. Thats not happening again and evert top 5 team roster is wrose going forward after salary cap this summer.

    I do believe we win another Cup in the 21 season to the 27 season. Were going to win again. Somewhere in there. When 19 88 retire at 40 Blackhawks arnt done. We could add two high end ufas like MIN did and still have a top 5 team for the young wave we have coming and who of them will be new core, for them to win.

    We had a dynasty and not satisfied yet.

  166. I just do not believe that you have to have generational players like 2 19 88 to win a Cup. Thats what you have to have to win a dynasty and dudes like 81 and 4. We did it and these guys are not washed up.

  167. The younger players need yrs like this to get better as they get better and get to the start of there prime yrs. It looks like the timing os going to work well for us with that.

    We were a 25-15 the 2nd 40 games and that wasnt all sch. It was mostly the roster. Now we made this many holes we had filled. Still want better and were going to get it but the 21 season should be about winning and doing sort of what we did in 2009. Getting the team primed and confidence for the 5 or so coming yrs, when were deep again.

    COL, may, win a Cup. Good for them. So will we. Thats all I care about. We do not have to win more then COL does in these 5-7 coming yrs. We already are up 3-0 on them. They will actually make us better for when we play in conference finals and finals again.

  168. Stape your 100% right didn’t give Blues any chance to win cup, thats why i refer to them. But at start of season didn’t think they were a last place team, but just goes to show you, get in and you have a chance to win. Hope Shaw can contribute, worry about his style too and what it means healthwise for him.

    Mo if you mean Joki, good chance he plays alot on Blackhawks roster. Tend to agree with Dehaan out for first 4 to 6 wks and Keith , Seabrook getting older and just the normal stuff, injuries could play a big part on the blueline this year. Don’t believe Dahlstrom and Koekkoek are looked at as regulars this season, if they need somebody to play a regular role, if you him there, why woukdn’t you use Joki. Looking forward to seeing how it plays out.

  169. What about big stronger heavy line like this for 3rd line.

    77 19 88
    12 17 82
    20 65 11
    91 22 64

  170. Well, looking at that lineup, I do hope that history does not repeat itself with Dach. He is drafted as a center and the Hawks should make room for him there if he makes the team. Coach Q screwed around with Teuvo playing him everywhere except his natural position which was at center. Yes, at times it helped the team but it slowed his development. He did the same thing with Nick Schmaltz which I thought was a little ridiculous because he was much more effective as a playmaking center. His 52 points centering Kane proved it and when he arrived in Arizona, he found his groove playing in the middle.
    I do agree that Stan needs to stop with these ex-Hawk trades. Silly!
    And with Bowman/Kelley’s lackluster performances the last decade drafting, losing more picks every year is not the way you build a winner. You need to have prospects in your system which allows you to develop them for the NHL or make hockey trades like Tallon did acquiring Versteeg from Boston or Sharp from Philly.
    I truly hope Dach does not play his opposite wing. This team is not a cup contender yet so if they keep him in Chicago, let the youngster play center. He can handle it.

  171. I just like a 20 65 11 line. Going by what you guys are saying then with 77 and 82 having to be top 9 and 15 in then this is what I had before.

    20 19 65
    82 77 88
    12 17 11
    91 15 22

    65 19 88
    12 17 82
    20 77 11 theres your heavy with size 3rd line
    91 15 22

  172. Teuvo’s development was slowed by Q playing him on the wing instead of centre?

    Teuvo has played mostly wing in CAR with either Aho or Staal as his C and produced 64 and 76 points in the last two years

    Another made up narrative

  173. @ORIGINAL6HAWKEY

    Re – Lehrner

    “when he no longer has substance abuse issues with many good years ahead of him.”

    I respectfully disagree with your statement. He will always have substance abuse issues, as will we all!

    Mine is sugar!!!

  174. I may be in the minority but I am not convinced that Dach makes the NHL roster to start the year. Management has proven that they are not afraid to “demote” their prospects if they are not producing at the NHL level. Joki and Sikura (and Schmaltz a couple or years ago) were all sent down for “seasoning.” I don’t think it’s a sure thing at all and I think it’s better than 50/50 he doesn’t make the NHL squad.

    Bowman has to plan for Dach not being in the lineup to start the year and then make an adjustment after camp if he is proved wrong. Again, I am not saying Dach won’t make the roster, just saying it’s probable that he won’t.

  175. Miro – you’re right that Dach making the team is not a sure thing and Stan should be prepared if he doesn’t make it and therefore shouldn’t be planning for him being on the roster

    Maybe he keeps AA for now for just that reason but they could also move Shaw to 3C if they need to – say they trade AA and Dach goes back to WHL

    Lots of options and if Dach makes it he should have earned it – no freebies

    Having said that I still think he makes the team to start but whether he stays past 9 games idk

    Also if he goes back to junior before the season starts no big deal – I’m convinced he’s going to be a very good NHL player whenever he’s ready

  176. @Wrap, I agree. Perhaps I should have stated, I suspect that Dach won’t play a significant amount of NHL games this year.

    Essentially I think the roster going into camp will be flexible enough to allow for Dach being on it, without depending on him to be on it.

    I also agree that whether Dach makes the NHL this season or not does not indicate the success of this pick. I think he will be a great NHL player eventually. The part I am not sure of is how soon will that start? I predict it won’t be this year, but I allow for the possibility that it could.

  177. Dach may very well go vack to juniors for another season. Biwman did make the statement after fa signings and Shaw trade that having 7 or 8 guts who can play center was the goal vs just 4 or 5. Cagguila has spent time at center too as has Perlini, not sure if they get to play there but they are depth.

  178. Sure, I guessing he plays 9 games though in the beginning of 82 games. Plays 9 40 82? If he doesnt play right out of the gate, then I guess he plays 9 somewhere or the entire 2nd 40 if ready.

    Thats where having 64 at 3rd line center, temporarily should be acceptable. Maybe 65. So when he is ready hes there. Like Wrap just said, he doesnt have to start at center, so maybe 64 or 65 is there anyways or 15 if hes still here at game 1.

    I really just looking for when hes ready and stays because when ever that is its not far away. He might not play until 21 season but I would be shocked, and fine with whats better for development-for him not normal prospects, if hes not in at some point this season and stays. And I mean more then a 9 game package of game tickets.

  179. Guessing he play 40 this season like most do, like Buckaroo just did and how Hammer came in. Then 82 from then on.

  180. Everything you guys just said I am thinking same. Ian, So he cant play the 2nd 40 because he has to be on 23 man or juniors again until season there. If thats the case then its 82 games or 9? If that is the thing then prob doesnt play 82 only 9 and plays 9 for sur.

    So it makes sense if he not on for whole 82 games hes really not playing until 21 season? because of juniors thing.

  181. Mo if goes back to juniors after 9 or 39 games it only means he burnt an elc year. If he stays 40 then gets credit for a year towards ufa and lose a year of rfa control, then he be staying for 82, because they want him to.
    If he goes to juniors then he’ll be there until their playoffs end which could be May. So might not be available again next year if he goes back. I think saying he”ll get every chance, means he might stay, those comments really never were said about Boqvist except for Q in training camp.

  182. Yea. He might play 82 games then. With Bo he was only 17 like Teravainen so really psrt of the next yr draft, kind of, so thats a yr there in a way. A lot players, prob half of them, are half age every yr anyways. Which they are used to there whole younger yrs anyways, at least at every level.

    Dach is ready enough, this yr we have Buckaroo for 82 games and Bo prob 2nd 40 games. Whatever each guy does, the 21 season has all of these guys for 82 games. Plus Mitch and Beau would be ready for 21 season to. A lot of them will all be ready for the 21 season.

  183. Look at the depth right now, Crawford, Lehner the 1-2 in goal with Delia and Lankinen, seems to be the deepest in awhile there.

    With Keith, Seabrook, Dehaan, Murphy, Maatta, Gus on the blueline. Joki likely steps in for Dehaan first month and a half and likely some continuing coverage, Boqvist if he goes to Rfd be available mid season or so and give Bowman lots of chips to address any needs he may want. Plus Dahlstrom and/or Koekkoek be available in a pinch situations.

    Toews, Strome, Anisimov, Kampf, Carpenter, Shaw, Perliniat center. Then you have Dach, plus in Rfd Highmore, Nilsson had a look and Entwistle or Kurashev at mid season and maybe Reese Johnson too.

    Wingers led by Kane, Debrincat, Saad, Kubalik, Shaw, Perlini, Sikura and Caguila can play top 9, in Rfd Wetin, Fortin, Saarela plus Kurashev and Entwistle at some point,

    Cagguila, Carpenter, Kampf, Shaw, Highmore, Quenbeville as 4th liners with Entwistle, Soderlund and maybe Johnson before midseason if needed.

    Gotta like the options going to be available for Colliton, obviously could more changes before the season starts and during.

  184. We have lots of depth like you listed. Dach is going to be a franchise player, when he is ready. Which is 21 season at longest. The 23man to start the 21 season will have everyone of the Four Horsemen if all still here, Dach, prob Kurachev. So thats 6 very good players, not just players that can play but difference makers.

    So is it needed at all for Dach to play this yr. He gets the experience that means he has a better 21 season. He doesnt, then “his” 21 season isint as good, but no matter what his 22 season and on is wicked hockey.

  185. That’s right. Dach is going to be our franchise player when he is ready. If it means a year of development, so what? Only thing that matters is the player he is capable of becoming in a few years.

  186. Mo and Original agree totally, Dach s future alot more important than playing next season.8

  187. Stan mentioned that right now there are roughly 18 forwards who are capable of making the team.
    I would imagine he will sit back and see if other GM calls about Anisimov as the summer goes on. This might be somewhat like the Nick Leddy situation in 2014-2015 where it seemed like he was the guy to go and we pretty much waited all summer for it to happen.
    Keep in mind, the trade deadline in February. Big Centers such as Anisimov always seem to be in high demand then. He might be more valuable then. A surplus of defensemen and expiring contract in Corey Crawford could make the deadline more interesting as well.
    We shall see. But Stan has pieces to use for sure.

  188. Craig another luxury Bowman can use, is waiting until season starts and usually teams have unexpected injuries that leave voids on their rosters that need addressed or maybe ltir space available that wasn’t there so they could get compliant for some teams and are looking to make trades.

  189. O6 Ian …a possibility for Dach is that when Rockford will be in the playoff next year he might join them for a few games iff is junior team is out . Plus he will also be at training camp and will have the previledge to play with the top players on Hawks Team …he will have have fun and learn from coaches players and trainer before going back junior …a few guys like Jako and Boqvist will help him .Beaudin and many other young guys will be there to learn and get focus on next step before going back to Junior.

  190. Aurora, good pots It doesnt make any sense that people still complain and make it feel, for a min, just for a min that its not good or a waste. Then you realize nah, what in the heck is wrong with peoples thinking sometimes. They just hate no matter what and find something to cling to thats a weak point negative. Must suck living life that way.

    I am sure theres people who thought same n 2013 that were wernt going to win. So it doesnt matter how good always going to be like that. Some just arnt positive people in any way and thats why. Theres a difference between realistic and negative.

  191. One thing is no team has to have as good as the dynasty rosters we had to win the CUp anymore. There isint any team that good or close or the really good teams we played agasint then. Top teas are watered down now, compared to those teams. So we only have to be as good as the other top teams, which with who we have coming were going to be.

    Caint wait until the 21 season and on. Even though this season will be fun necause it will be fun again and were on the verge.

  192. Correct. Every team starts the season with “One Goal”. Doesn’t matter if you’re an expansion team, (we seen that almost happen) or defending Cup Champion(seen that happen).
    All it takes is heart and chemistry. You can have all the talent in the world but no heart and or chemistry it won’t happen. What did most points get TB? Wrong trophy. People saying 20-21 or 21-22 is are year. Guess what, I want 19-20 to be our year and that’s what I’m cheering for.
    We have a shot. That’s all we need. A chip and a chair can get you there.

    GO HAWKS!

  193. Hawks2010, Dach is ineligible to play in the AHL. Players drafted out of the CHL must be 20 by Dec 31 of that season or have played 4 full seasons in the CHL. Dach turned 18 in Jabuary and has only 2 full seasons in the WHL. So, not only is he ineligible in 2019/20, he’s also ineligible in 2020/21.

    It’s WHL or NHL.

  194. Something nobody is talking about. What is going to cost to extend Gustafson ?
    Power play quarterback. 60 point defenseman. 1st pairing.
    That decision needs to be made between now and the trade deadline.

  195. EB depends on whether he signed his elc, an unsigned prospect can sign an amateur tryout with Ahl team after their and be eligible for playoffs. If they sign him before then to his elc, he would need to do the tdl paper move and be assigned then to Rfd. for their playoff roster, which as you said he couldn’t do. Chances are they will sign him fairly quick.

    Craig looks likely only 2 of Gus, Murphy, Dehaan and Maatta be around more than this season, with cap demand. Other moves could be made over and above Anisomov but those seem more likely.

  196. Ian – are you sure he can sign an AHL tryout contract when his rights are owned by the Hawks? Even if the AHL team is Rockford? That doesn’t seem right, let alone a good idea.

  197. I thinking the 60 pt Defensmen is not happeneing again. Maybe he does or does 40-60 every yr. The reason why I think thats not happeneing again is this.

    We were in a transition yr, in 18 and 19, and in those kind of yrs weird thing can happen. Not saying 56 is not going to do that every yr or he wont even be 40 pt player because I think he does that 40-50 as OFF D guy. but this.

    In transitions yrs wierd things happen, like we were one of those teams that was that good at OFF and that bad at DEF. Reminds me of how TOR has been the last 10-15 yrs, those kind of teams. But for us it was only because of being a transition yr. Thats goes for the PK as well.

    Were not going to be like TOR has been last 15 yrs and be top 5 OFF and Bottom 5 DEF or have one of the worst PK in 25 yrs. Those thing only happen, to us, in transitions yrs like that.

  198. EB ato is used on unsigned prospects in the system quite a bit, especially if not expected to return to juniors, owning their rights has no bearing. Thing is with high picks teams usually lock them up quick. They could not sign him until next spring, he would have to go back juniors at end of training camp though if unsigned. He could sign a ato with Rfd after his juniors season ended and be eligible for playoffs. Don’t see it used alot if player is going back to juniors but can be. Also have to way it against if Rfd going to be around longer than junior team in spring.

  199. An interesting thing on the DEefensmen and who staying will be here when were deep again is this. Even though Bowman awas only talking about the blue chip prospects, it may go for who we have now to. He said after getting Vlasic that its going to be awesome to see how each of the Four Horsemen be a pair with Vlasic.

    So with that thinking, we keep the DEF Defensemen more then the OFF Defensemen of whos on the 23man man. Or we could trade a Horsemen and keep 56, as well.

    Just seems like when he said that, even though he was talking about Horsemen and Vlasic as different options for a pair. Having those 4 options at anytime, not just for one good pair.

    Injuries could be a factor in this. Which guys are better for that and that might take care of itself.

  200. Roamn, your right we could win in 20 and this season will be even more fun then last yers games 30-80. Which we only had a 3/4 roster. The first 30 games we had a 1/2 roster with those tank ufsa. Now with the moves we made at, before draft, draft, trades, ufas, we have a full roster again. Something we havnt had since the 16 or 17 season.

    I have enjoyed talking with you guys, Ian ER, Wrap, Original, Ernie, and others this recent half yr, since we made roster adjustments and could see were are good again and that was with 3/4 roster. Talking about the moves were going to make and that we were going to POUNCE this summer. Bowman said he would and he did and didnt trade anything of too value to get it. Really we didnt trade anything basically and those picks will come back, and with how Bowman does it there might be another 12 in there with the shuffle.

    Be able to get exiting about the Blackhawks again was only a matter of time. It was a ruff two yrs but neccessary to reload the better way. Now by doing it that way we have two top 5 elite players coming very soon and will be a big part of another Cup. Who knows but we might not do it without that, tank ufas that got us two top 5 players.

    You cant finetune until you have a full roster and we have that now. Whats exciting is now we finetune each yr, as the several blue chip players young wave comes in.

  201. Mo look at the numbers next year 19, 88, 20 and 65 are 30.9m. Assuming 2 and 7 return lets say for ballpark figure Boq and Joki replace Murphy and Gus. With Dehaan, Maatta and Dahlstrom, your’re looking at about 23.8m. Lehner if resigned assuming he gets a raise be 6 or 7 so be at least 7 or 8m goalie hit.

    So that’s 30.9+ 23.8+7 = 61.6m say plus likely another 12m to sign 12 and 17. Leaves about 10.4m for 8 more fwds at 84m cap with Kubalik and Cagguila taking close to 5 of it if signed, both arbitration eligible. You could have Dach, another elc with Sikura and Qyenneville plus Kampf and Perlini to round it out as cheap as possible, likely 6m at best. Thats in 84m range there, so if your keeping another 3 to 6m with deducted replacement salary around for Gus and Murphy something has to give, might keep one if Kubalik and Cagguila replaced by minimum salaries, maybe Saad moved might keep both. If Strome regresses might squeeze some room there on his salary. Only other option is a major shakeup of core, unlikely.

  202. Think 7 traded at some point. Were not going to trade young core player to keep 7 at that point, when those guys need higher caphits.

    It does add up, so you guys are right about who we have for D now aint staying longterm once young wave need caphits.

    It should work though because of having so many on elc, then we got to be creative and chisel another core again. By then though 7 and others should make it work. And not having 2-3 m caphit players like 11 91 and others. Get the Kurachevs and Barratts in there on elcs.

  203. I am thinking guys like 20 are staying for awhile and guys that are the ‘3rd line players’ and ‘3rd pair players’ that are on 2-3 m caohits do no stay. We reload with good europe and young players on elcs.

  204. Ian – the Hawks were lucky not to have their best years in this new era of players coming off their ELCs getting paid big $ like Matthews, Marner (when he signs) and others like Laine, Tkachuk etc.

    Imagine if T and K went straight form ELC to their current 10.5 million deals the Hawks probably only win the 2010 Cup and maybe not in 13 and 15

    This also goes the point that Roman and Mo I think made – in this era every year every good team has to readjust to the cap as young guys get paid and cap space needs to be opened up – it’s even harder to keep a really good balanced team together than it was when the Hawks were a mini dynasty

    So each year if you’re good enough to make the playoffs you’re good enough to contend for the Cup – why couldn’t Hawks win again any year in the next 3 or 4 before T and K really start to fade

    This year won’t be their best shot but they can realistically say if they make the playoffs they have a shot – STL this year was not the team any of the 3 Hawk Cup winners were and obviously either was BOS

    I agree that the Hawks are back to competing starting this year and hopefully for the 2 or 3 years after this one they should be even stronger

  205. I do not think there was any team as good as the top teams from 2008-2015 to 16ish, the last 4 yrs and going forward. Salary cap just watered down, someone said here a yr a go or so, the entire top 10 teams. Thats why all the sudden a team PIT could win or be good becuase they could not play with the ‘real’ top 5 teams during those yrs. Same for WAS and STL, even though WAS ans STL were top 5 or 6-7 teams during those yrs, they couldnt then. Then did right after, with less of good of rosters then they had. Thats why TB might do it now, going by that.

    Yea its good that we do not have to have ‘that’ dynasty or one of the best teams rosters, other then us, like LA 12 13 14 BOS 11 12 13 ANA 13 14 15 TB 15. Those were the top teams after us and there is no team like those now and prob wont be again. It was kind of like the tipping point of the salary cap era, where teams got loaded and could keep it for awhile and then you cant.

    When I say 21 season and on its because were going to be deeper, but this yr were deep enough again to play and its just a matter of finetuning each yr to make roster better and there will be lots of upside from the young wave. So COL will be good and others will not be anymore/as much, theres always some other top teams you have to beat to win.

    I like our team and organization better. And there shouldnt be any other dynasty in the next 25 yrs maybe because its that hard to do with cap. And winning the same total amount of Cups does not count as a dynasty. In which I look at LA and BOS as the best teams after the Blackhawks in this first 25 yrs since last dynasty.

    dynasty teams and best teams-that went head to head with dynasty team
    EDM NYI DET CHI
    ? ? COL LA and BOS

    good teams that happen to win more then once
    NJ PIT

  206. Thats prob not fair to NJ to compare PIT to them. NJ at least earned there Cups, PIT had one given to them by refs/league when NAS outplayed them and deserved to win, but whatever those teams are not dynasty teams and thats what matters to me more.

  207. OTT
    TOR
    MTL- how many were because of having first 10 draft picks every yr
    EDM
    NYI
    DET
    CHI

    Those are it.

  208. It appears Stan’s long term plan is 3 years at this point.
    DeHaan, Maatta, Shaw, Carpenter all have exactly the same term left. All were acquired in the last few weeks and have that specifically in common.
    Saad and Anisimov have two years left.
    Gustafson and Crawford are officially in their contract year.

    RFAs Strome and deBrincat are no brainers and will get their money.

  209. I think Strome can be part of the future, but he needs to avoid a “sophomore slump” this coming season. He needs to pick up where he left off and show some development as well. He got off to a great second chance with the Blackhawks and it needs to keep going before they commit the bucks to him I will state that I DO think he will show that improvement. Dach is counted on to be the future, but when that future is may be up for grabs.

    The Lehner signing looks like it threw cold water on the Dzingel signing, but he is still out there last I checked. Internet rumors are that he could be headed to Edmonton. Also read where Ferland could very well end up with the Blues. That would be a good pick up for them.

  210. What goes red/green, red/green, red/green, red/green, red/green?

    Answer: Hull65/Mikita21/Makita/Savoir/Totti/Fonsi in a blender!

    ribbet ribbet ribbet

  211. Agree that Strome still needs to continue to up his game if he wants to be paid. He had a great start with us, but I thought he tailed off towards the end of the season and while it was good that he played for Canada at the worlds he didn’t play a big role.

    The thing I like about him is that he almost always does something positive with the puck in the offensive zone. Protects it well, waits guys off, and is able to thread the needle in tight spaces. On the the other hand, I wonder if he is getting too predictable (as the year went on I notice more of his cross ice passes down low were getting picked off). He also needs to get stronger, better in the dot, and better all round.

    Also, there is no reason that he and Debrincat get treated the same way as 19 and 88 did. Debrincat can score playing with anyone. Strome has more to prove. So if Debrincat gets paid (as he will) that doesn’t mean Strome shouldn’t get something more along the lines of a bridge contract.

  212. Good post Jordy – I was a bit disappointed in Strome’s WC performance but that’s at least in part due to his skating being exposed more on the big ice surface – it’s less on an issue on the NHL rink but he does need to get stronger and continue his upward trend – a good 1/2 season does not cement him as a regular 2C although I am optimistic about his future in that regard

  213. With Strome he does always make good plays in OFF zone. I think he does those short in tight passes all the time and half work half do not. He just always does those, so I think those are more streaky in a way then people getting used to him. Pretty much every video of him and Debrincat and that other player has him doing those kind of in tight passes.

    Those guys were just relentless with them, scoring chance after scoring chance. Some were goals more were not but chance after chance.

    For contracts yea think same. 12 get long 5-8 yr deal and caphit like that. Same thinking for 17 mabye bridge 2 or 3 yr makes sense, he hasnt earned the 5 or 6 yr at 6m contract yet.

  214. Pretty much every video of him and Debrincat and that other player has him doing those kind of in tight passes.

    In juniors.

  215. Jordy, hard to predict where Strome’s contract goes, he was traded for Schmaltz and he signed for a 5.85 aav deal. If that has any bearing or not, i don’t know but the feeling so far is Blackhawks got the best of the deal. Debrincat too, hard to say how high he will go, may try to get it done early, not doubt his agent will still want his market value, which could be kinda scary.

  216. Where do you see Debrincat, Aho got 8.425m aav, is that ballpark, certainly worth more than Nylander 7m, Marner be higher again, but he won’t get that kindq money not likely.

  217. A couple of contracts to watch that moght impact Debrincats extension could be Brayden Point of Bolts and Brock Boesner of Canucks. Both rfa that may be around what he will get.

  218. For what it’s worth, I’m told not to expect a Perlini signing. Hawks trying to move him. Hmmm. If true, this show how Colliton truly has a voice. He wants sandpaper.
    Stan is trying to get that for him. Perlini floats a lot.

    I also learned a bit about Jokihariju this weekend. But let’s see what happens with Perlini first.

  219. Aho was reportedly looking at the neighborhood of $10M per… Montreal underwhelmed with their offer sheet but front-loaded it to try to get Carolina to balk at the payment structure. I think whenever Marner gets done you’ll see Point & Boeser get gone and then you’ll have an idea of what DeBrincat might be looking at. If the Hawks want to lock up DeBrincat longer term (read: more than 4 years) I’d be looking at $7.5-8M per based on Aho. If they can get him to agree to 5+ years x $7M I’d consider it a victory

  220. Tab, I like those numbers for 12 caphit. 5 yrs might make sense for him, then hes 27. 17 is 27 in 4yrs.

    Craig, yea for the past couple days I have been thinking maybe not keeping 11 to sign another good player.

    What do you mean about Buckaroo, that hes ready for 82 games.

  221. Jordys right though I didnt realize Strome only played 20 games first two yrs. I thought it was like 20 82 82. So a bridge does make sense in that way.

    12 for 5+ 7m
    17 for 2 5m, then another 2 for 6m

    Thats 12m and 13m for those yrs, which is good. Thats the same as Sharpy and Saad.

  222. Craig, Nothing agasint 11 but can see what were doing with what type and who were getting to fill out the roster to being full roster again.

    Its those kind of players, because like Hull says we really didnt have any/much. Now we have the kind of players we did in 2009 and 2010 for those roles.

  223. Debrincat 5yrs for 7m, be great, if he wants term and happy with the Blackhawks he might trade off on this contract a bit, even under 8m per be low on money end. Then go for the big payday when a ufa as Mo said, not having to go crazy getting him and Strome signed goes a long way next summer.

    Craig, kinda of wondered on Perlini, qualified him but really didn’t seem to make signing a priority since the season ended.

  224. Craig – interesting intel – here’s my speculation

    Even if they trade Perlini I think they still need to move someone else – they might just squeeze everyone under the cap without Perlini but that leaves no wiggle room during the season or ability to be active at the TDL neither of which they should want

    Maybe they delay the decision to trade someone other than Perlini now by having de Haan on LTIR to start the season but eventually before de Haan comes back I think they will move someone else as well

    For argument’s sake let’s say they trade Perlini instead of AA from the forward group then de Haan starts on LTIR with Joki taking his place – assuming no injuries and Joki playing well maybe they trade Murphy so Joki stays and thus freeing up some cap space for in season and TDL moves and eventually new contracts

  225. This was from an article on the Athletic from Scott Powers on June 30th talking about the Shaw trade. The Hawks had not signed Lehner yet, so perhaps that move changed the thinking on Perlini.

    Here is the part about Perlini:

    As far as Perlini, that contract isn’t as simple as the ones the Blackhawks have already negotiated with their restricted free agents. Perlini doesn’t have arbitration rights, which is beneficial for the Blackhawks, but Perlini does have 45 goals and 72 points over 199 career NHL games and that is usually worth something extra on a second contract. Both sides will likely work out something in time, but it could be a slower process.

    “And Brendan, I’ve had a very introductory-type talk, but we haven’t really gone past that,” Bowman said. “There’s a lot going on right now and he’s a restricted free agent without arbitration, so it’s not as urgent to get that done by the first of July. I don’t anticipate being issues on (Perlini and Kampf) contract-wise.”

  226. Also think we add good player at deadline, its not just for a rental. Like 27 he was a rental be ‘really’ an add to keep. I see us adding a player like that this deadline, like 26. The deadlines after this season would be more rental terms like 80. Is Carpenter are new Madden. Sure looks that way.

    Madden
    Krugs & Frozal
    Carpenter

  227. Bill saw July 15th to 19th for developmental camp and Sept. 6th to 10th for Traverse City Tournament.

    Wrap thats kinda what i think they would do and probably need to clear more cap
    at some point before next July for bonus overages. Strome 2.475m and Debrimcat $132,500 are most likely. Joki $425,000 possible too, Dach if he makes team could be high number there too.

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