Talking Duncan Keith with TSN 1260
On Tuesday morning we talked about the Duncan Keith trade with TSN 1260 in Edmonton. Here’s audio from the interview:
On Tuesday morning we talked about the Duncan Keith trade with TSN 1260 in Edmonton. Here’s audio from the interview:
100 thoughts on “Talking Duncan Keith with TSN 1260”
It was a nice interview, I liked the points you made @Tab. I don’t understand what the Oilers pundits think they are going to get for the same money in Free Agency. How much does it cost to bring in the experience of winning three Cups and still be an effective defenseman? Maybe I am over estimating the value that Keith brings to that locker room, but he is the kind of guy that will make the rest of that team better, by simply being on the roster. He is the guy that will help young inexperienced players figure out how to handle the pressure of winning. How do you not covet that? I’m really freaking tired of listening to people whine about how the salary cap is more important than character in your locker room.
Edmonton rolled over in the playoffs two years in a row. There was no reason that team should have lost to the Hawks last playoffs and I am not sure what happened to them this year, but they simply should have shown better than they did. Keith can and will help with that. He may not be able to do it all himself, physically, but I bet that entire locker room will shut up and listen to what he has to say whenever he opens his mouth. Overpay? No, the Oilers did not over pay. Oh, they paid, it cost them. But get over yourself Edmonton, you are a much better team now than you were 24 plus hours ago.
Completely off topic, but did everyone see that Minnesota bought out the last four years of Parise and Suter’s contracts? The dead cap hits for the next four years are pretty brutal, especially years 2-4..makes the trade the Hawks completed yesterday look even better in comparison..wonder where Suter will sign next year? On a cheap one year deal, he could definitely help a playoff bound team looking to add a veteran defenseman..too bad Suter wouldn’t be interested in the Hawks(I’m assuming) because he would make a great sign and flip at the tdl candidate..
Good discussion and overview of the situation. Agree don’t see how tyey get through next 2 pr 3 weeks without Bowman facing the media at some point.
I want to see Bowman keep making very good trades like he has since last yr keep adding good players.
Load young wave!
Really Glad we had Keith for all those years ..
Seth Jones ( 27 y o when the next season start )numbers are falling every year since 2017. I think he would be a good fit for the Hawks and could sign a 3-5 years contract when he arrive at around 5.5 to 6 millions $. But what does the Hawks will offer to get him ? Probably 2 or 3 young prospect ( Boq, Beaudin, Mitchell, Regula, Kalynuk , Suter,Strome, Entwistle, could be Targeted I think )
It could be a step up or a step back depending on who will go .
Not a easy decision but getting Caleb Jones shows the Hawks want to reunite the brothers for sure ( at what cost ???
No place for mistakes.
Right. Keep “loading” the young wave…. and then kick the tires potentially with Marc-Andre Fleury?? What’s up with that?? As far as StanBo facing the media?? He’s already got his excuse ready, they are “investigating” it. That’s all he’s got to say and he’ll repeat that excuse until the media is blue in the face. Liked the interview and the podcast.
now that they cleared 5 mil cap it’s seems Hawks want Fleury and knights probably getting strome carried 3 mil cap. both with a year left on contracts. Well with toews & Kane aging this makes sense for last effort push & add 2 quality D guys !
Was thinking adding Jones or Flury we need top pair guys to be a top 5 team again so they have to come at some point in summer of 2 22 or 23 for when were ready in season 24 if thats when.
For adding FLury ohers its good to tradeline which gets us more 2nd round picks and taht is loading young wave.
Get as many picks as we can and pick good players in draft enough will be good players.
If we have 25 picks we ll get more good players then if we have 15 picks.
What happens if Kieth decides to retire at some time during his last two contract years? What is the burden to the Hawks Cap?
Keith s not a Hawks anymore he will play for Oilers now.
He is not on the Hawks cap
He was trade 2 days ago
If Keith retires after next season the Blackhawks recapture penalty of 5.5m in 22-23 and 2m in 23-24. Unlikely he retires before that but a prorated penalty for this season would be calculated at that point. Personally i think Keith sounds committed to play out his contract with Oilers and won’t be an issue.
S. Jones B. Montour
Like that look but still need to develop Boq, Beau, Regula Vlasik C. Jones Philips. Mitchell Krys Lincoln probably use to get S. Jones and more likely one of Boq or Beau.
Correct on Bowman can not comment on an on going investigation.
Ian, thanks. Hope he plays out his contract well.
JR, you can not assume Seattle takes DeHaan.
It’s not a legal investigation involving law enforcement so the no comments aren’t a legal obligation. No doubt the Independent Revue as it is labelled, plus the confidentiality of parties involved will limit any real discussion on the topic. Tabs point in the podcast was so far Bowman has not faced the media in any form since the Aldrich allegations story broke, that seemingly has to change very soon as on ice moves will demand it
Mike, thinking giving Seattle something to take deHaan is going to happen. You can give them a D prospect other than one of the Bs or C. Jones to give the blue line some breathing room. Would like to keep Regula Kalyunk Stillman Vlasik Phillips. Giving them Mitchell should do it.
Yeah. I’d pass on Fleury. He has a kind of “brittleness” that doesn’t serve a young team well. His stretches of brilliance can be train wrecked when he makes a crucial mistake. Plus, too much money for where we are at.
In regards to the rumor about adding Fleury, if the Hawks were to look into adding Fleury, I don’t think it would be because the Hawks think they’re in a substantially better position this year to make the playoffs and they want to add a veteran goaltender..I think they would be taking on the last year of Fleury’s contract so LV can fill out their roster..right now, LV needs to add a few forwards and a couple dmen to their current roster and they only have $6m in cap space..and since LV is exempt from the expansion draft, they don’t even have the opportunity to expose Fleury..so I think the Hawks may be looking for a 2rd next year or maybe a 3rd next year and a B prospect to provide LV with $7m in cap space that they can use to re-sign Martinez, add a Hyman, etc..which to me is the best way to utilize our cap space..and, extra bonus, we could also flip Fleury at the TDL for another pick..so we could effectively double up on the same player..this is the type of deal I hope Bowman focuses on instead of moving Dach, Beaudin, and a 1st for Jones(which is about what I think the Hawks would have to give to Columbus..they’re not trading him for Regula and two 2nd rounders)..I’d rather do a couple of ”weaponize cap” deals this year and then just go after Jones next year when he’s ufa..if the Hawks are determined to spend almost all of their newfound cap space this year, then I would lean towards Hamilton if only because the Hawks wouldn’t have to give up the additional assets that Jones will require and in terms of skillset, I think they’re pretty similar..
@jrroman..I wouldn’t give Seattle anything to ensure that they draft DeHaan and here’s why..1. right now, their choice from our roster will come down to Connolly, Carpenter or Gaudette among our forwards..they’re probably not taking any of the three..and DeHaan and Zadorov among our defensemen(I believe we’ll protect C Jones)..if they take Zadorov, that’s fine..I’ll assume that if the Hawks expose Zadorov, it’s because they feel as though he’s going to be too expensive to re-sign or they just prefer Jones for multiple reasons..so if Seattle wants to select Zadorov and negotiate a new contract with him, let them..we’ll keep DeHaan and then try to flip him at the TDL for a draft pick..and if Seattle takes DeHaan, then that’s fine..his cap hit immediately comes off the books and we can continue to negotiate with Zadorov and/or go to arbitration where I don’t think he’ll make much more than his current salary..my point is, the Hawks are really only providing two options to Seattle, and each benefits us in their own way..Zadorov or DeHaan, flip a coin..neither is a great loss to the Hawks..what I don’t want the Hawks to do is give up a 4th rounder just to keep Zadorov..is he really worth an additional pick? Saad and a fourth for Zadorov is what the trade ends up being..that’s not how you rebuild. I think the Hawks have done a good job of steering Seattle towards one of the two defensemen..no need to lose draft capital to steer them one way or the other..and if Seattle throws a curveball and selects Subban, so what..you can still try to move DeHaan at the trade deadline and figure out what you’re going to do with Zadorov..the only time you give a pick is if you’re trying to free up cap space for multiple years..for instance, if Seattle is interested in taking the last three years of Seabrook’s deal, then you offer a sweetner..but not for one year of DeHaan..
@ian, yes, I think the Hawks are fortunate that Keith is a workout fanatic..couple that with the fact that he won’t be playing 25 min a night anymore and I think he’ll be fine playing out his two years in Edmonton without any injury or lack of desire to play..I’m going to optimistically assume that his cap hit is of no further concern to the Hawks..
Brandon Carlo got $4 Million a year from Boston. You could make the case that he and Zadorov are similar players.
THink Roman is just laying it out there for what we should do/be good to do.
We should be doing those trade to add prospects and then tradeline to add more 2nds. Get the top pair guys from ufa tahts what I said long time ago.
You donot trade 77 or even 27 like taht.
Craig, Are the hawks going to trade this year’s first round pick?
If they don’t trade the pick will they take Chaz Lucius if he is still available?
The most impressive “trade” of all time was 2 1/3 Duncan Teeth per Stanley Cup Championships (7 teeth / 3 cups). The man was a talented warrior who left us Chicago fans with too many memories to say.
@Craig..Carlo’s possession metrics are much better than Zadorov’s..his extension actually works in the Hawks favor..if a top four defenseman with better metrics signs for $4.1 per, Zadorov’s contract should be under that amount per year, if the Hawks pursue re-signing him..so that’s very good news for the Hawks if Zadorov wants to go to arbitration..my ideal contract for Zadorov would be something like $3.4 per year for 3 years..and even though that in itself may still be a slight overpay, he would be paired with one of our young defenseman..so collectively, that pairing wouldn’t be as expensiv- even as a third pairing, which is where I think Zadorov would end up..maybe a Zadorov-Regula/Mitchell third pairing as an example..
the ideal contract for zadorov is one with any team other than the hawks.
an underperformer with regular full game disappearing acts during a contract year. what level of effort and consistency would you expect from him with a three or four year contract in his pocket?
I haven’t seen Carlo play more than a handful of times over the last couple years – so take this with a grain of salt – but if I were asked to choose between Carlo and Zadorov – I would choose Carlo. He seems more predictable than Zadorov who seems to lose his way in the play a little too often to be relied upon in crucial situations. I’m not a Zadorov hater and wouldn’t mind if he were re-signed with a decently low salary cap number – but I also wouldn’t shed a tear if he were to move on.
Sebastian Cossa would also be a good pick If they want a goalie…and could move down a few pick and get another second round pick for the move …iff they need a Goalie.
More I read about Cossa more I like him .
Not easy task when your pick is at number 11 …
I ok with Zador for one yr at 4m area caphit/could be more just donot use what we need to tarde for adding prospects/picks from taking on caphited players so we can do good/sneaky adds.
Make suer we keep adding the summer tardeline players theya re important to help load young wave and allow the younger players to play in spots not over there head. The trickle effect spots so they can be in depth chart where they should be.
Stape – No. Hawks not trading first rounder this year. I know they really really like Lucius. However, a lot depends with what happens with the goalies. If Wallstedt gets taken that likely pushes a higher ranked forward down the list.
Stape-Definitely No on trading #11 overall. I know they really like Lucius.
The question becomes : does a team ahead of the Hawks nab a goalie such as Wallstedt ? That would push down the list of top forwards.
Only Tavish is larger then Lucas and Sillinger is the same.
So is Lucas a good 200 ft player wih physical like these other two.
Craig – interesting that the Hawks seem intent on keeping this year first so if they’re serious about Jones it’ll start with next year’s first which hopefully will be lower than 11
I also don’t think any trade for Jones will include Dach or Boquist – others yes but not those two
CBL can only deal with a few teams because of Jones modifiesd NTC and the Hawks got more prospects from which to choose than some others in the running – plus I read that a NHL.com Radio host said he heard that Jones wants to come to CHI
Something like Kurashev and Mitchell and a first in 2022 should get it done – maybe not even that much
Slayer – I like your take on who to protect from the D – leave Z unsigned and exposed
Good chance Seattle passes on Z and that way Hawks protect Murphy Stillman and C Jones
I’m also on record as being OK with MAF for the same reasons you outlined as well
as 8 months of mentoring Lank however he may be too expensive if they sign S Jones – we’ll see
Might be a re-post or I didn’t click on post comment.
Slayer good points and I agree with you. My fear is the CDH won’t stay healthy and reach TDL to get something for him.
If Z gets picked then Oleksiak a must. A one year with Z then maybe use him at TDL for assets. I am one of the few or maybe the only one that would like to keep Z for a while. He could turn out to be our future Rosi or Soper.
If S. Jones is the target then for our Cup team of ’24/’25 or ’25/’26 would like a D corp of S Jones B Montour Boq/Beau Regula Kalyunk C Jones.
Wrap to take Fleury on last year of his deal for 7m, and Jones at 5.4m all Blackhawks could be very close to getting under the 81.5m cap limit with all rfa forwards signed, without ltir by moving Strome and one of Dehaan or Zaddorov. If all 3 of those moved be room to spare. The return for Jones the big issue right now, roster freeze starts tomorrow with protected lists from teams due for expansion draft. No trades after tomorrows freeze until expansion draft over. CBJ likely go into a true rebuild and start their search for bottom for a few years and want to rebuild from bottom up if Jones is moved, so likely younger prospects and picks be their ask.
Craig is Coronato no longer in the picture for Blackhawks no.1 pick, or is it only if he falls to 2nd round.
Ian. No doubt they like Coronato but not sure they will nab him at 11. A lot of this will be determined on draft night as the top 10 shakes out.
Logan Stankoven– 5’8″ midget– who scores-skates… Supposed to have “Debrincat -type ” release
wouldn’t be surprised if he turns out to be one of the most productive players in this draft. Gonna be a steal – like Dcat was for some team.
JR, I like Montour but he is RD, just like C.Jones, S.Jones, Murphy, Boqvist, Mitchell and probably a couple others I’m not thinking of right now. He’s listed as LD/RD so maybe he’s proficient playing either side – don’t know. I don’t see Regula developing into more than a NHL/AHL tweener – just doesn’t skate well enough. I think there’s a better chance for one of Vlassic, Krutil, Phillips or Kaiser to be on the Hawks roster in 2-3 years.
I’m very high on Kalynuk. He is so smooth, has good offensive skills and get’s engaged physically. He could afford to put on a few pounds but at 6’1″ at least he’s not a midget. He’s 24 so probably already at his peak physically so now it’s just a matter of getting games of experience under his belt. I like he play either side too but I hope he get’s more time at his natural LD position this season.
@ebonyraptor..Caleb Jones is a left handed d so right now, the Hawks top right handed dmen are Murphy, Boqvist, Mitchell, Regula and Krutil and Kalynuk, Stillman, DeHaan, Zadorov, Beaudin, and Jones would be the left handed dmen along with Phillips and Galvas in the AHL..lots of depth on the blueline even if we lose one of DeHaan/Zadorov to Seattle..agreed regarding Regula..there’s still time for him to show more, but I wouldn’t be surprised if he tops out as a 3rd pairing guy..Vlasic and Kaiser, at least this far into their college careers, are showing more upside offensively..
agreed regarding Kalynuk- hopefully, he will be able to play his natural side this year..he looks the part of a top four defenseman already and there’s still some ceiling left as he gets more nhl games under his belt..how the Hawks blueline looks this upcoming season will be one of the more interesting stories of this offseason to watch unfold..
@jrroman..very true..if we hang onto DeHaan, who knows if he even will be healthy enough to move out at the tdl..it would be nice if Seattle took him off our hands..I’m with you as well on Zadorov..if Seattle drafts him, I won’t lose much sleep over it, but I’m not opposed to re-signing him to a reasonable 3 year deal..if the Hawks don’t land Jones/Hamilton and DeHaan is taken by Seattle, the Hawks will have an incredibly inexperienced blueline next year with Murphy being the ”elder” at 28 years old..Zadorov could at least be a bridge to the next wave of defensemen we have developing..I think a lot depends on who Seattle drafts..once that domino has fallen, the Hawks will have a better idea of who their personnel is and what steps they want to take next..and this is just a hunch, but I have a feeling that the Hawks don’t want to spend on a Hamilton/Jones and also re-sign Zadorov..if the Hawks sign Hamilton, for example, then the blueline could look like this(I’m assuming just for this example that DeHaan was taken by Seattle)-
So with Hamilton in place, I think the Hawks feel like everyone would be slotted better and a combination of Stillman and Jones can provide enough of Zadorov’s production to move on from him..and if they trade for Seth Jones, (again, assuming DeHaan has been moved), the blueline still looks similar-
So in either scenario, I think they would then move on from Zadorov. But without that number 1 defenseman, the Hawks probably bring back Zadorov just to add some experience and size to the blueline.
@wrap, if the baseline for a Seth Jones trade is Kurashev, Mitchell, and a first, then the Hawks should definitely be trying to complete that trade..because even if I just ignore the players involved, the trade is basically a 1st, 2nd, and 4th for Jones, and that’s solid value in return for a top pairing defenseman..however, I’d be shocked if they weren’t asking for Dach (maybe Reichel too) as part of the package in return(which to me is a conversation ender) which is why I continue to lean towards Hamilton since I think he’s comparable to Jones offensively and wouldn’t cost any assets in return..but if Columbus is open to what I’ll call a mid-level trade(where no elite prospects go back to Columbus) then as a Hawks fan, I’m interested..
Dougie Hamilton is very good offensively but his defense is not good enough to be a 1st pair guy unless his d-partner is a defensive stud like Slavin is in Carolina. The Hawks don’t have a Slavin to be an effective partner at LD so Hamilton can play his offensive game at RD. Maybe Kalynuk will be “Slavin like” someday – maybe even someday soon, but we don’t know when or even if Kalynuk will grow into a #1 role. I think signing Hamilton would be a huge mistake, especially when considering he will be 30 in 2 years which is the optimistic timeframe for the Hawks rebuild to transition from rebuild to win-now. His lean/lanky body type doesn’t seem the type to stay at peak performance into his 30’s when the Hawks would need to get 4-5 years of optimum play out of him to fit in the “rebuilt window”. It’s just all speculative projection on my part but I really hope the Hawks don’t hitch their wagon to Hamilton.
Signing Hamilton means you need to pair him with a responsible partner. I’m in the camp that Boqvist is not there. His time with Keith proved that – look at all the stats you want, and many have reported they are not pretty with Boqvist, but the eye test clearly indicated that pairing was a mess. Boqvist needs to learn, and that doesn’t happen very easily on an island.
I’m a solid NO on Hamilton, have been and will continue to be. I do not like Dmen that prefer not to play defense. He is penalty prone too, which makes him an even bigger liability.
We had a Hamilton light. But we traded Gus. We don’t need the adult version.
No Hamilton please. He is a weak D and would be on a Hawks team in need of defense. Also IMO he is way to soft
@ebony, @silent..I’m not a huge Hamilton fan either and I think it was obvious to Hawks fans this year that in all of the games we played against Carolina, Slavin and Pesce were and are their top defensemen..and yes, ideally, you would pair Hamilton with more of a defensive focused partner to offset the fact that he’s mainly an offensive defenseman..but it looks like the Hawks are focused and committed to acquiring either Hamilton or Jones this year despite neither being very strong defensively(although Jones at least makes more of an effort than Hamilton)..so I was just presenting how I think the Hawks would incorporate either onto our blueline..in Hamilton’s case, I do think they would pair him with Boqvist and then have them take primarily offensive zone draws(they would also be the pp options) while leaving the other two pairs to focus on defensive zone draws..again, I would prefer to sign or trade for a true two way defenseman if the Hawks are going to give out a large contract, but if the rumors are true and the Hawks are circling the wagons for one of Hamilton/Jones, then I think the best way to utilize either would be to pair them with an offensive partner and then have them focus more on offensive zone draws and pp time to try and limit their exposure defensively..it would also allow the other two pairs to focus more on defense/puck retrieval/penalty killing, etc. without having to worry as much about contributing offensively..it isn’t ideal, but I do think it would be the best way to incorporate either onto our existing blueline..
@silent..Gus had an outlier year but he’s shown in subsequent years to be a replacement level defenseman..Hamilton’s offensive numbers every year are near elite so he is appreciably better than Gus..it’s his defensive shortcomings that are the concern for whoever signs him, Hawks or otherwise..
Watching Seth Jones only a year ago in the playoff bubble vs TOR he was every bit (both O and D) a #1 D – he had a bad year as did everyone on CBL – I don’t think he’s forgotten or is physically incapable of being a bona fide #1 again – I feel sure he will be for many years yet
The Hamilton interest I hope is merely theatrical on the Hawks part to use as leverage in acquiring Jones – I hope the Hawks are not seriously interested in spending the kind of $ and term it would take to sign Hamilton – his commitment to defence is simply not there
I no for Hamilton.
How about Jamie Oleksiak for 3-4 years .and probably not to expensive.
Defensemen moving all over. Ex- Hawk for Ex-Hawk in Leddy for Panik. Colorado moving another big Defensemen in Graves.
Pairing Hamilton with Boqvist wouldn’t be a good idea for at least a couple reasons – one of which is they’re both RD and I think it would be a bad idea to have one of them play their off side when Hamilton can’t play defense very well on his strong side and Boqvist should be allowed to develop on his strong side before being asked to play LD.
@ebonyraptor..I made a mistake when I posted initially..I thought Hamilton was a left handed d..that’s why I had him paired with Boqvist..I don’t like defensemen playing on their backhand either..Hammer was the only one in recent memory who seemed to prefer it and played his offside for years..but usually, I would like each defenseman on their strong side..so edit my post to have Kalynuk-Hamilton as the top pairing which actually looks even better and would allow Boqvist to play on the third pairing..
@wrap..Jones tends to pass the eye test because of his combination of endurance, skating, and size-but if you google ”is Seth Jones elite?”” you’ll see plenty of articles showing how the analytics don’t support him as a top defenseman and haven’t for a few years..he’s been steadily declining offensively and defensively..his poor play wasn’t limited to just last year..that said, Hamilton has his own defensive issues as well (although his analytics indicate that he’s still elite offensively) so who’s to see which way the Hawks are leaning? Neither player is the perfect solution, especially if the Hawks want to be better defensively-although you obviously feel that Jones is the more complete player..as for the Hawks, I don’t think they are talking about Hamilton just to help with their negotiations for Jones..I think they’re determined to make a splash on the blueline this offseason and while I’m sure their number one choice is Jones, if they can’t pry him away, I wouldn’t be surprised if they make a big offer to Hamilton..PS-I’m also sure the Hawks are aware of the poor analytics for Jones over these last few years and maybe that’s why he’s their first choice..perhaps they feel they can get him for 70 cents on the dollar and gamble on a change of scenery helping him recapture the way he played when he was in Nashville..it’s very possible..
@jrroman..yes, lots of action before teams have to lock in their protected lists..makes me pleased to see since there could be some opportunities after the expansion draft for the Hawks to weaponize some cap space..teams like the Islanders and Vancouver are still going to be tight against the cap even after Seattle makes their picks..
Slayer – I’d be interested in the analytics from that Leaf play in series last summer because I bet they support my contention of how well Jones played – so maybe he hasn’t been playing well in CBL during the regular season – I’m guessing he wasn’t happy there and consequently not that motivated or inspired – once in a place he’s happy with the Seth Jones I saw vs TOR I believe will be a regular occurrence
These are the sort of shrewd moves teams have to make in order to compete – maybe it’s a bit of a gamble that Jones will be more consistently a bona fide #1 but one worth taking IMO
If his analytics were off the charts he’d probably be staying in CBL – he knows he needs a change of scenery to recapture his best – it’s a testament to his character that he’s made the decision to move on – another reason to feel good about acquiring him if they do
However you are right that his bad analytics in the last couple of years will be used by the Hawks to drive down the cost of acquiring him
Imagine Hawks getting Zack Hyman and Jamie Oleksiak how it would change the game . Then they can get Zadorov out because he is asking to much $ for the talent he has.
We can get those 2 players for 3-4 millions $ / player total 6-8 millions $ .
Just my 2 pesos.
Kalynuk might be our best LD and considering he’s played only 21 NHL games averaging only 16:16 TOI – that’s quite the testament to the dearth of quality LD’s on the Hawks. He has good offensive instincts too so he’s certainly not “only” a defensive d-man and because of that I would rather see him paired with Murphy who is certainly more of a stay-at-home d-man than Hamilton. Hopefully the Hawks don’t acquire Hamilton so the exercise of twisting the d-pairings around to accommodate Hamilton won’t be necessary.
The idea of paying a King’s ransom to acquire Seth Jones is a bad one to start with, especially (1) when he could be an available UFA next summer, and (2) he’s not a knock down no-doubt-about-it #1 d-man … but, if the acquisition of a #1 d-man is going to be pursued this summer – maybe some consideration should be given to acquiring the #1 pick from Buffalo and drafting Owen Power. If the rumored asking price for Jones is Dach or DCat, Boqvist or Mitchell and the #11 2021 pick – then maybe Buffalo would trade the #1 pick for a package a little less detrimental to the Hawks rebuild and the Hawks would not only get our #1 d-man of the future but get him at 18 years old and on a 3-year ELC.
Just a thought.
Yandle was just bought out….could be a good inexpensive D man will offensive upside, plus an iron man that is rarely injured, and would QB the PP unit….just a thought. Maybe a good mentor to Boq.
Need to get rid of Zadorov….not worth the money…
Very easy to get rid of Zadorov.
You give him to the team who offer the best deal …. a third round with a few hockey stick should do the job , maybe in Ottawa or Montreal or ?
No need to get a big return…we just need to move on if Hawks don’t believe in him .
This is a bit off topic, but given how, as @beerleague just pointed out, Yandle was just bought out, Suter was just bought out, Leddy was just traded for a second rounder and Panik , and Graves was just traded for a second rounder and Maltsev, it makes the Keith trade look even better..Keith is older than all of the above players and the Hawks got close to the same value that Leddy and Graves brought back with a third rounder and C Jones..obviously there were some unique circumstances involved in the Keith trade, but still, I wonder if this trade would have been made with zero salary retained if it was being negotiated today, for instance, instead of earlier this week..the timing of the trade definitely benefited the Hawks..
Does Yandle fit what we need? 34 years old?
It’s a tough line to walk right now on what type and for what purpose of Dmen to bring into the team. We have a plethora of players right now we need to evaluate. Again I say – Why block Boqvist? Isn’t he the future of the PP? He needs to play enough for a fair evaluation this season. Contract time is coming up.
Do we need some better Dmen? Yes. The question is can we grow any. What are we doing with the kids this season? If half are gonna spend the season in Rockford, then flipping a Yandle makes sense. If you are looking to play them on the NHL club (which the kids totally expect), then 34 year guys are only in the way.
I don’t know what the team’s plans are, but I have a feeling we will learn in the next 2 weeks.
I think we need under 29-30 y o
And we need big guys.
Keith Yandle was bought out because he’s not that effective anymore – pass
ER – agree that if cost for Jones is any of Dach Boquist Reichel then it should be a pass but I don’t think the cost will be that high – I also think they don’t need to put in the 2021 #11 pick but could put in their 2022 first rounder which is what they’d get if they wait until TDL
As you say ER Jones is not a no doubt #1 if you look at his last couple of years so the price should be lower and CBL is boxed in a bit with Jones list of 10 teams plus he holds the hammer with saying he’ll sign an extension or not – he’s got a lot of leverage and the rumour is he likes CHI – I’m hopeful it happens for reasonable price as alluded to above and then he recaptures his #1 D form
This is the sort of trade if successful (meaning he recaptures his #1 D form) accelerates the rebuild – he’s still only 26 although 27 in Oct
According to Powers the Hawks did what some of the conjecture was here – they left Z unprotected
I don’t think Seattle signs him – he’s arb eligible
Also Kampf was protected but not Gaudette- a bit risky perhaps although they probably figure it’s more likely that Kampf if unprotected would be selected rather than Gaudette
Kraken probably take either Z CDH or Carp
I’m fine with any of those
Did you guys see the Andrew Ladd trade today?
This is the exact kind of a trade that Bowman should have been looking to pull off.
Arizona New York Islanders
Andrew Ladd No Return
2021 2nd Round pick
Conditional 2022 2nd round pick
Conditional 2023 3rd round pick
Adam Larsson is reportedly going to sign in EDM for 4 years at 3.9 per approx – if it happens can’t think of a reason why Z would be higher than that and should be lower – potentially good news for the Hawks
Protection list according to a source reported by Scott Powers from the Athletic:
Interesting – Kampf over Gaudette and no Zadorov.
FORWARD HENRIK BORGSTRÖM
FORWARD ALEX DEBRINCAT
FORWARD BRANDON HAGEL
FORWARD DAVID KÄMPF
FORWARD PATRICK KANE
FORWARD DYLAN STROME
FORWARD JONATHAN TOEWS
DEFENSEMAN CALEB JONES
DEFENSEMAN CONNOR MURPHY
DEFENSEMAN RILEY STILLMAN
GOALIE KEVIN LANKINEN
No surprises. the Blackhawks must be very confident that Toews is not damaged goods.
Hawks protected exactly who I hoped they would..now let’s see if Seattle takes the bait and selects Zadorov or DeHaan..even if the hope for Seattle is to be able to flip DeHaan at next year’s tdl, you would think they would find him more attractive than Carpenter, Gaudette, or Connolly..we shall see..
@stape..I think the Hawks would have done a deal similar to the one Arizona made w/ the Islanders for Ladd except for two points..1. I don’t think they liked the second year on Ladd’s contract..they already have two years of Connolly’s deal left so I don’t think they liked taking another contract with more than one year of term left and 2. until they figure out whether they’re going to add to their blueline, I think Stan wants to keep his available cap space..things could change of course but for now I think he wants as much cap space as possible..
Wrap, protecting Kampf, leaves little doubt who is going to be the shutdown center taking the majority of dzone fos. Toews probably takes alot of ozone and the bigger draws.
Wrap, tahts the thing tim and place and where teams are and for that yr or a few yrs. CLB was good each yr until Bob left and they loaded roster at tradeline and beat TB. Since then they are half roster why would any player want to try there best.
Thats why BOS was good for 4 yrs and ISL are the new BOS they care have a really good team system and its worth playing your best because things are right. BOS realized a yr ago they cant beat TB got blwon out on there godd 4yrs yr 1 and 3 and this yr ISL are the new BOS with a really good team system and have the hunger.
ISL are the ccloset team to beat TB and not beacuse game 7/even with a 7-0 blow out game 5 because most games were close. BOS was 4-1 both times. When TB wants to play/not when they donot show up to play game 6 and game 7 agasint WAS noone close/ISL are only close team.
Point is when your on a top team and there is worth like BOS last 3 yrs and now ISL are tthat team you go as hard as you can when there isint the worth anymore like after TB blew out BOS for 2nd time in 3 yrs/not a coincidence BOS was in finals onlyt time they didnt play TB then you have stats like Jones has last few yrs.
Lots of comments on the Athletic and Hockeybuzz(not sure why I torture myself on the latter lol) from Hawks fans that are frustrated about Kampf being protected over Gaudette..feel free to comment below and let me know what I’m missing..I never even assumed that Gaudette would be protected over Kampf..Kampf is exactly the type of player you build a fourth line around..granted, he provides zero offense, but neither did Kruger or Desjardins..he does, however, wins faceoffs, turn the ice over, starts 70 percent of his shifts in the defensive zone, has a great takeaway to giveaway ratio the last two years..still is just 26 and I’m assuming won’t cost much to extend for the next 2-3 years..I can see exposing him if the Hawks had Barkov or Horvat on our team(young centers who routinely take 20-25 draws a game)..but even if Toews were healthy last year, he’s also 33..doesn’t it benefit our top six if Kampf can go over the boards and win some dzone draws..takes some of the pressure off Toews so he doesn’t have to take 25 draws a night..Gaudette has more offensive upside, yes, but he’s not good defensively and he’s not strong at the dot..there is a reason he was traded straight up for a fourth liner in Highmore. He’s not a guaranteed top nine forward although he has some ceiling to his game. Fortunately, I don’t see Seattle taking Gaudette, but even if they do, I still think the Hawks protecting Kampf was the right move..perhaps in a year, the Hawks center depth will be stronger if Borgstrom, Reichel, Suter, Kurashev, etc. continue to improve and develop..but right now, Kampf is our most reliable centerman, which is why he got protected..
Slayer – well said re: Kampf
At the moment he does his job better than Gaudette – that may change but it’s a good bet SEA is not that interested in taking a player who might be better than he’s shown so far because he’s apparently fixed his stomach issues – no need to reach like that if you’re SEA
If’s a calculated risk on Stans part but even if Gaudette is selected it’s not changing much in CHI
I think Carp or DeHaan is their choice with the dark horse being Subban
Notice that Carey Price has been exposed – now that’s risky
Wrap, with no apparent deal to not take Price, hard to imagine Francis wouldn’t pick him. If not to keep, could easily retain half his caphit and get some major assets in return you would think. You would think if he waived his nmc once he would again even if it was his wish to be out west. There’s a few teams would scoop him up, like Canucks, Oilers or Flames.
Kampf has been underappreciated since he got here – at least by this board. There are a few that see what he brings and how important it is to a hockey team, but many here only care about goals or knocking someone into the 5th row with a hit.
Most importantly, the coach and GM know his value, and certainly his teammates. Ask his goalies if he is important.
Keeping the puck from opponents makes it somewhat more difficult for them to score against you.
I confess that I’m prone to being bedazzled by shiny objects and hence I would rather have Gaudette than Kampf. Gaudette’s potential for offense is a shiny object more attractive to me than the drab and boring Kampf. But Kampf has value and is the type of player who plays an unheralded role that is necessary to winning hockey so as much as it isn’t very pretty – maybe in the end it will be better to have one Kampf in the hand than two Gaudettes in the bush.
I agree with Kampf over Gaudette as well. No loss if Seattle takes Guadette but if Kampf was availabkle and taken then that`s a hole to fill adequately for sure.
That`s a pretty good deal for the Oilers for Adam Larsson if true. I`d take Larsson over Zadarov any day, especially at that price. Larsson would be a good fit here and wouldn`t cost us the assets that Jones will. I like Jones a lot but what`s the cost? Would Strome, Boqvist, and a swap of firsts get this done.
I really would like to see Zacharyl Heureux becoming a Hawks,we need a player like him big time …the kid is a Brad Marchand type
5,11 195 pounds just turn 18 …will become a 6,1. 205 pound or more player when he grow up but most important is his attitude on the ice this guy can change a game in half a second ,,,,strong , focus, and a real warrior.
We need him badly….he is there at around 22-26 pick
Why are we keeping 17 over Gaudette? I guess we can have some temps like Yandle and Strome if there only here until were deep again.
Anyways like Wrap Silents posts on things that seems to be the way.
Whens the draft and spot the expansion team with a top 5 ot 10 roster righ off the bat without earning it sucking for 10 yrs forced against will draft.
Someone list dates and ufa so when I on vacation I can put on Tazer sweater taht day and smile with pride.
Its because Krugs and Madden had full roster/let alone a dynasty roster so it looked ok then with half a roster/that we have last 3 yrs since we were top team in league we have gaps in roster and players in higher trickle effect spots then they should be for most ideal spots or even lower which makes us that kind of deep.
So hes the perfect ideal 4th line/as a checking line center there is just like Krugs just the overall roster is why people think that/ I did for a min because people are thinking big picture reload like Silent posted about Defensemen same thing.
Other thing on Kampf is Krugs had 4th line wings score goals more then our do now so where Krugs didnt score much more goals then Kampf does the left and right did so overall whats the goals and assists for entire 4th line each yrs for us since 2009 and remember the dynasty yrs are once in a 100 yr kind of thing/2009-2015.
Still whats the totals for that. 2009-2021
I donot give a shit about MTL a team that got the first 10 draft picks every yr for the first 50 60? yr of hockey.
To do that to Price because he didnt play as good in 4th round as he did agasint a 100% OFF TOR team a non playoff WIN team and a wornout? from beating COL VEG team then you play an actual top 5 team and get blwon out.
MTL should have got blwon out in 2nd round by BOS or ISL and then they wouldnt think they are good and put in there proper place in 2nd round not finals when they did NOT deserve to be in playoffs as a 18th place team-agasint an all candian 56 game sch. Then even if Price had 4 SO and thats only way they beat BOS/ISL get bown out in 3rd round by TB/when they actually should have played those teams.
Wont happen again/corona making sch 4 mth layover then right to playoffs in fall and then a 56 game all canadian division and 2 rounds of playoffs right into conf finals sch. again/not again. Thats once in a hundred yrs kind of thing.
Does anyone actually know the true history on that with MTL getting first 10 drafts picks every yr for first 50/60? yrs of hockey.
Did MTL get 1-10 then TOR get 11-20 and OTT get 21-30 and then other original six teams CHI BOS NYR get pick 31-60? or any?
WHat yrs did this go on from yr 1 to yr 61?
To me then those yrs donot count in Stanley Cup totals and it starts around yr 1960/which ever yr that nonsense stopped.
Now I add up the Cups for every team since it was somewhat fair/salary caped-redwings and see whose won and had dynastys since its was a fair slate from the start.
Ian can answer your Questions about draft pick from Montreal but it’s not the fist 10 picks and not the first 5 picks …I think it was just the first pick from Quebec players plus their regular pick …something like that. But not what you wrote at all .
Mo there was no draft prior to 1963, teams sponsored players in early teens thru juniors and basically Habs had most of the French players wanting to be part of their organization. Habs had option in early drafts of picking in normal spot or take first 2 french candian players. First years only a few players only 21 in 1963 were drafted because teams already owned best players rights from sponsorships. They did use the first 2 french player option until 68 taking Plasse and a center who never went far, in 69 they took Tardiff and Houle who both went to Wha and gave them limited years but were good players. After that everybody drafted in order, no perks, like it shoulda been.
Where Habs benefitted most from draft was when expansion came, Sam Pollock wanted a rule that expansion teams couldn’t trade top draft picks for quick success and tilt the draft. Gms said no and Pollock went out to prove them wrong by making trades of vets for 1st overall picks like Lafleur etc. and built a core to win multiple cups in 70s.
Ian – agree that if I’m Francis I take Price – lots of options with him going forward
He’d be a good asset to have – I really don’t understand why Bergevin is taking this risk unless he’d be happy to be rid of the contract and for Price to waive his NMC he must be happy to move on from MTL and out west
Still surprising on both fronts – losing potentially Price to protect who? Jake Allen – really? a career back up? and Price must really want out if he’s willing to go to an expansion team
So now the Habs could be without Weber Price and Danault next year – yet another reminder of how dramatically things can change from year to year in the NHL
Sorry guys,I have never understood the Kamph supporters. Stonehands and has not improved at all. Is not very physical but I digress…For the purpose of Expansion,Seattle would never have thought about taking him so I guess we were stuck with him regardless. A developmental/rebuilding year of Kamph,Strome,Carpenter,and Nylander. YUCK. Just doesn’t excite me or give me hope that we won’t continue to be outshot 55 to 15 on home ice as we are checked through the boards.
Price will get chosen by Seattle then they’ll flip him to a team that is a goalie away from the cup (e.g. Boston). That’ll give Price a shot at a cup before he retires because Montreal won’t get close again before he’s done. That’s why he waived his NMC.
Puck – I wouldn’t assume SEA flips him – maybe they will maybe they won’t – there’s no guarantee with the caveat that Price still has his NMC in place to block a trade if he wants to
There are worse ways to start your franchise than have Carey Price your goalie for 4 or 5 years although there would be a nice return if they do flip him
I just don’t think Price or Francis is thinking the endgame is necessarily to get traded from SEA to a Cup contender
Wrap, you may be right. Last time this happened Vegas rode Fleury to the finals.
@pucklogic@ian..good points regarding Price..perhaps Seattle will look to flip Price and turn him into more assets..I’m not sure..I’m assuming Price was exposed by Montreal because they’re going to try and secure a new defenseman this offseason to replace Weber and they could use the additional cap space..but I don’t follow Montreal much so that’s just a guess..even if that is their logic I’m still surprised..Price was a true difference maker for them in the playoffs this year..essentially, he performed well at the very moments that you hope a 10mil a year goaltender performs well..Seattle will definitely be selecting him..they’ve got the cap space to grab Price and sign Driedger which immediately gives them a very strong 1-2 punch in net..
@wrap..very true, from the stanley cup finals to an offseason where you’re looking to replace your number one goaltender, a top 3 defenseman and your best defensive centerman..going to be a tough offseason for Montreal as they try to rebuild their roster while replacing some significant pieces..
@ebonyraptor..I usually also lean towards the ”shiny new toy” upside forward..but I also think about all of the draws that the Hawks lost this past year that immediately turned into goals for the opposition..leads that we couldn’t hold in the third period simply because we couldn’t get the puck back..and then I think about this upcoming year and how the Hawks will look at the dot if Kampf was drafted by Seattle and maybe Toews has some early season struggles as he acclimates to missing an entire hockey season..we may not win 50 percent of our faceoffs in a game until Christmas lol..I’m being slightly facetious but my point is that in terms of the way this roster is constructed today, Kampf adds a lot of value to this team..and I do agree, he plays a very boring game..but when you’re trying to hold a lead late, I’ll take boring all day as opposed to an ill advised stretch pass, late penalty, etc..
Staying on the subject of the Hawks 4th line, did anyone notice that Pittsburgh exposed Brandon Tanev..the contract did look like an overpay as soon as they signed him, and I really have no idea if Seattle would select him..but if they didn’t, would anyone here be interested in the Hawks trading for him? Not sure how the cap space numbers would work(I guess a lot depends on how the Hawks construct their own roster this year) but I like the player. He would immediately add a dose of physicality to the forward group and even though he would play on the fourth line, he’s got some offense to his game..would a Hardman-Kampf-Tanev line be intriguing? Anyhoo, it probably won’t happen for a myriad of reasons, one of which being that the Hawks currently have about 18 forwards of their own that they’re trying to sort through lol but I did always used to love how Q saved the 12th forward spot for a winger with some thump to his game(although technically I think Q just liked keeping an enforcer out there, at least Tanev chips in offensively too)..oh well, Tanev is probably the type of player you sign when you’re about to make a deep playoff run, not when you’re rebuilding..I just thought it was interesting that Pittsburgh protected a 36 year old Jeff Carter over him so I’m assuming it’s the contract they’re trying to shed more than the player..
Slayer – I’m guessing that Pitt thinks their window as long as Crosby and Malkin are there is open and that Carter is part of that
Didn’t he perform well since joint Pitt including in the playoffs?
Price with hip injury and possible knee surgery, may miss most or all of next season. Looking like they protected Allen to have a goalie for next season and Price gave them the chance to do it.
Thanks, I didnt want to say more then I have to people the last 7 yrs about that without more info.
So if there was no draft before 1963 and thats when/is basically the first 50/60 yrs of hockey how in the heck did OTT then TOR then MTL in that order win 55 of the first 60 Cups and CHI BOS NYR win about 5 of 60?
They have 90% of the sponsors? Were the sponsors equal for all 6 teams. Something seems off there.
After 1963 like you guys said makes sense.
To me I always thought since someone told me about the draft thing was that prior to 1960 I guess 1963 those yrs didnt count because it wasnt fair-done right and to kepp those first 60 yrs of hockey in a seperate category/not delete it just seperate.
Now count the Cups since 1963.
Kampf isn’t the worst thing in the world. He’s a decent penalty killer. Good on face offs. However, feel his negatives outweigh the good stuff.
He loses almost every board battle in his zone. All. The. Time. And by players smaller that him. He’s terrible on the forecheck. He has zero puck skills. Poor hands. Not terribly good at skating. He’s not physical, which is critical to the role.
Not looking for him to light the lamp every game but he had 1 goal all season. Not good anyway you look at that for the center position.
He’s collecting a check. Can’t see this team winning with him.
Tim, if it gets us another top 10 elite player from 22 draft thats a good thing to have those players for one more yr. Then at some point in 36 mths we need to make the move to the hardnose players we need to add/so its by the time the young wave is really ready. Getting one or two more top 10 elite draft players is very important to have enough elites from drafts where we got to pick top quality.
Not every player is elite so having more top 10 picks is important. The more the moar will be.
Theres nothing wrong with adding a top pair guy now/this summer so even if hes 33 by the time we add the 2nd top pair guys is 30 we then can trade the one we get now and get another whos 27 so there we have a 30 and 27 top pair age wise and young wave is ready and deeper in elites because we had to pick top 10 for one more yr.
Lets at least start egtting those hardnosers in here so we can watch some Hansons brothers action while we suck to get better core/young wave.
Theres where I like Zad for another yr so while the players like Barratt come in we get more and more of those kind and they start to implement the Hansons style before our very own eyes.
TRIP, Good to hear your view on Kamph. I was starting to think he was something special and I was missing it. Your description of him was on the money. You can role any other Center out there for his minutes and you will get more offensive production and physicality. Hell,maybe win a board battle or 2. Chip in say 10 or so goals. He is sucking up developmental ice time from potentially better and more complete Centers looking for a regular shift. MO, I think there is a happy medium between keeping soft players and us getting our brains beat in as opposed to maybe grabbing some guys who are hungry with an edge until we get our ideal top of the lineup filled out. These soft guys aren’t cheap either. I.E. STROME. Then we still have the China Doll DeHaan soaking up 4.5 Million per and the every 3rd game physical Zadorov demanding close to 6 Million. This is insane. Move on from these question marks.
Ian – I think Bergevin is trying to bluff SEA out of taking Price
We know he had injuries this year but to leak reports that Price may need surgery and miss the entire year sounds like a con job especially since Price isn’t seeing doctors until after the expansion draft – other GMs are pissed because the rules state that all SEA gets full medical reports on all players
Now I want SEA to take Price even more
Mo wouldn’t protecting Gaudette instead of Kampf help us get a top 10 pick moar in the event the Kraken would have picked Kampf, which I doubt?
We must not trade our first round picks this year, 2022 and 2023. We need to add young talent, not finish in 4th and lose in first round. 2022 and 2023 are loaded drafts with three franchise players each. We can’t miss out on chances to draft them.
Hard pass on Jones (cost too high, seems in decline) and Hamilton (no D and we’re not one PP QB away from being a serious threat to win the Cup). Stan should weaponize the cap space and stockpile picks for 22 and 23 drafts.
BOS has a top 5 goalie thats good they need there top pair Defensemen back who left because he was low balled/Krug.
What top teams needs a top 5 goalie ISL COL.
Yeah MTL will have to play a real sch from now on and thats BOS/ISL in 2nd round and TB in 3rd round. If they make playoffs they were the 18th place team with a canadian sch.
BOS had there chance until they didnt give Krug what he deserved like we did for our core players.
YEah I want to add a few of those kind of players while we see who were keeping/not and keep developing. I know adding players like Tanev/other say wait until right beofe were ready though getting some along the way but not blocking young wavers is good idea because then we already have some of them that we need.
It just wouldnt be a player we tradeline we keep longtermish wise.
Yes yes load young wave! Add top 10 draft quality. Add top pair Defensemen by ufa wait until Jones/other are ufa and get them for free.